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Discussion Sentiment

51% Positive

Analyzed from 2971 words in the discussion.

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#food#generated#menu#don#bad#menus#restaurants#looks#design#more

Discussion (69 Comments)Read Original on HackerNews

dev0p•20 minutes ago
The loss of personality is real. The most heartbreaking ones I've seen are in schools, or anywhere that children are involved.

For example, at my local preschool there was a wall flyer with information about what to bring the swimming pool. It had the most crudely drawn fishes and crabs and seahorses that I had ever seen. It was clear that whoever drew that had no prior experience with anything even remotely resembling a pencil, and by no metric one would define those drawings as "good". Maybe it was drawn by a janitor, or a teacher with too little time to waste on a drawing? Regardless, and I cannot emphasize it enough, I VASTLY preferred it to the new AI generated one they put up, with its generic AI generated marine life that one would get if they just typed "sea life" in the prompt. I can't tell you why myself, if you were to look at both versions side by side, the AI one is undoubtably miles better. But... it just feels wrong. Off. Out of place. I know I sound like a luddite, but it just doesn't look right. It's uncanny, and I really can't explain the reason. It's like seeing a perfectly drawn, realistic, anatomically accurate human being in an otherwise cute and cuddly children's cartoon. It just doesn't fit in with everything else. It's a preschool, it's supposed to be filled with "bad" drawings, you know?

And don't get me started with the time they put up AI filtered group photos. I almost had a meltdown, and I'm (mostly) pro AI.

mablopoule•10 minutes ago
Because the AI one are soul-less, and the badly drawn ones are not, simple as that.
mathw•14 minutes ago
Also why do they have sea life in it at all, surely that's not something that's meant to be in the pool.
dev0p•13 minutes ago
Water equals fishes and stuff, I guess. Makes sense to me.
diabllicseagull•32 minutes ago
I get the consumers' ick when I see an AI-generated menu, logo, or sign as much as the next person. Beyond that, there is an argument to be made about the discrepancy between the pictorial depictions of a food item and what you are actually served in real life. I wish something akin to Japan's strict food packaging laws existed for restaurants.
simonw•39 minutes ago
I'm fascinated by how AI poster designs have taken over local advertising in seemingly just the last six months - presumably because ChatGPT Images and Gemini Nano Banana finally got good enough at outputting text without obvious defects in the typography.

The posters all look good - much better than their desktop publishing predecessors. And yet they also eat away at the credibility of the event or business for me.

It's hard to trust a poster when the quality of the design has zero relation to the amount of effort that went into creating it.

But is that a widespread feeling, are the vibes bad for regular people, or is this effectively just old man shouting at clouds?

jodacola•11 minutes ago
My perspective on this, as someone skeptical of (but also bullish on) AI, is complex and I haven't completely nailed it down.

My knee-jerk reaction is instant credibility loss for the business/person/thing.

Follow-on is sadness (what are we losing in society because of this?), and curiosity: if a polished appearance (even if it is mega plastic) is no longer a sign of quality, then what is? What signals do I need to look for now?

But, wait! Was a high degree of polish ever truly a sign of quality? I've certainly had experiences where a place made every effort to look polished and professional (and generally did a good job at it), but quality missed the mark. In the case of restaurants, a common refrain of mine used to be, "they're trying too hard in the wrong places." Now, I guess, they don't have to try too hard... but they're still not focusing in the right places.

I don't know what to make of it and I go back to still trying to figure out new (or old?) signals for quality.

vkou•6 minutes ago
A high degree of polish was tangible evidence that someone in the organization gave a shit about their work.
couchand•32 minutes ago
Not just you. There's been a huge pushback in the local music community around this. Concerts listings now prominently feature the name of the poster designer! Humans FTW.
tgv•19 minutes ago
> how AI poster designs have taken over local advertising

Tale as old as time: a race to the bottom. Businesses trying to cut corners, thinking they can offset it against losses from exiting customers. If it wasn't, a lot will just cut more corners.

simonw•8 minutes ago
I don't think it's a corner cutting thing though.

These businesses weren't paying someone to make a flier. The business owner was sweating for an hour in Microsoft Word and producing something that looked terrible.

I expect they are now investing approximately the same about of time iterating in ChatGPT and producing something that genuinely looks like a huge improvement to them.

OtherShrezzing•25 minutes ago
>But is that a widespread feeling, are the vibes bad for regular people, or is this effectively just old man shouting at clouds?

A cursory glance at YouGov strongly suggests that people have bad vibes about AI in basically every territory where they're asked about it, and for basically every use-case

simonw•7 minutes ago
How many of the people who answer polls like that also have the ability to look at a poster and instantly clock that it was AI-generated?
a1o•20 minutes ago
There’s a lot of times I see people reaching for AI instead of taking a photograph, this is super egregious when it’s meant as a reference, because the AI generated image won’t necessarily look like the real thing. I’ve seen it used in reference documents about animal management/veterinary reference meant for farmers, and the generated cows, horses and so on are just worse than the original version that was done with photos, they may look more “clean”, but farm life isn’t meant to be clean and it also lost the veterinarian that was shown in the shots manipulating the animal and properly indicating with hands where to pay attention in the animal.
_joel•41 minutes ago
Well at least the peas weren't upside down...

https://preview.redd.it/the-peas-are-upside-down-v0-5pwo713b...

abrugsch•6 minutes ago
looks like every kebab shop menu near me. All offerings crudely cut/pasted/mashed together. 5 near me literally have the same menu with different prices and a colour theme to match their (usually terrible, 3-D font effect from 90's era Corel Draw) Logo. And they were like that BEFORE GenAI got popular!
huhkerrf•9 minutes ago
I don't think that's AI. It looks more like crappy photoshop.
abrugsch•5 minutes ago
Not even photoshop. Literal cut and paste of physical photos :D
whywhywhywhy•31 minutes ago
This is unironically soulful though.
gegtik•about 1 hour ago
I do think that AI signage/advertising is the new signifier of low-effort, low-skill output and that is how it will be perceived by clientele.

Similar to someone just scrawling a sandwich board sign in chalk (which at this point I would prefer).

Businesses will stand out from a taste perspective by continuing to hire human effort to make recognisable human output.

dec0dedab0de•about 1 hour ago
Writing in signs and menus in chalk has been a signal for a high quality restaurant for as long as I can remember. With photos of the food, and/or ring bound menus being the worst.
PyWoody•41 minutes ago
I knew someone that actually got a degree in like letterprinting with a minor in menu design. She went from town-to-town creating these beautiful chalk menu designs and lived a pretty modest life.

One day a tattoo parlor asked her to make a sign. She did. They asked if she had ever thought about getting into tattooing. She hadn't. They gave her an apprenticeship.

After completing her apprenticeship, she's now booked so far into advance that she closed her book to the public.

I think about her all the time now, what with software engineering going the way that it is. What lateral like passion could I transition to, as she did?

square_usual•13 minutes ago
Photos of the food, at least in the US, started with "immigrant" restaurants. When Thai/Vietnamese/Chinese restaurants started opening up in areas without high concentrations of those people, they'd put photos in the menu so you could see what you were getting since that wouldn't be clear from the names or descriptions in the menu. A lot of these restaurants were cheap, which is why I think you associate it with low-quality restaurants.
amelius•about 1 hour ago
Chalk writing robot/printer in the making ...
taude•about 1 hour ago
The Tour De France had one a long time ago, writing chalk signage on the roads [1]. I had to search for the YouTube video about it....

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Khffa2GkvPE

Jtarii•about 1 hour ago
Escaping AI slop will become a privilege for the wealthy.
biophysboy•42 minutes ago
Low effort products will be used by low effort companies. In the case of restaurants, this might not necessarily be bad - I’ve been to amazing taco/burrito shops w abysmal menus. But if I went to a “high end” place with an AI menu and instagram decor - bad, bad sign.

I genuinely think AI companies need to worry more about their brand. Just through how their products are used, they are perceived as a marker for low quality.

ghostly_s•36 minutes ago
Anthropic has been running the exact same video ad in my youtube feed for months showing a guy making the tackiest "impossible" coffee table hanging from chains that I wouldn't even bother clicking on if it were a thumbnail from a favorite woodworker. I'd think if ChatGPT were such a great creative tool they could use it to create more than one ad....
huhkerrf•9 minutes ago
Are you implying that Anthropic is using ChatGPT internally?
_override•about 1 hour ago
My personal opinion is that these days most people simply wouldn’t be able to tell that the photos are AI generated, and even if they could, they wouldn’t care or have any strong thoughts about it. I don’t think my parents or any adults aged 50+ in my family have spent any time at all playing around with AI image generation tools or comparing AI-generated images to non-AI-generated images to be able to have any opinions about these things.

So until more people frequenting restaurants care it’s a relatively low risk and low cost way to update your menu.

reactordev•about 1 hour ago
Senior citizens are the most vulnerable
hei-lima•42 minutes ago
I live in Brazil, and on our delivery apps (like iFood), AI photos have become a plague. It's so bad seeing pictures with that distinct GPT look. You just don't know what your rice and beans will look like.
mjhay•23 minutes ago
In the US, some of those apps were generating gross nonsense like showing an image of a pizza with a sweet pie filling (because the menu said “pizza pie”).

I don’t get how AI images like this don’t open them up to false advertising lawsuits

FinnLobsien•about 1 hour ago
I've come around to the other side of this in a way. I used to think "wow they don't care at all" the same way I previously looked at menus clearly made in MS Word: The place will probably be cheap and they don't care about having fancy menu design.

From there, it's two possibilities:

-They care about the food at the expensive of design and it's going to be cheap and great (good) -They care about the food as much as the design and it's going to suck (bad)

This switch happened after a new place opened in my neighborhood that had AI signage and is now my favorite lunch spot.

spider-mario•about 1 hour ago
Perhaps in part Berkson’s paradox in action? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkson's_paradox
FinnLobsien•3 minutes ago
Possibly, but I think it’s a bit more intuitive than that. It’s basically just like companies with terrible websites:

Most of them are terrible because they no longer exist, have no budget because they’re not making money, or because they’re bad at doing things generally.

But then there’s a set of companies that do fantastically well and are so busy serving customers (or are satisfied with their results) that their website doesn’t matter. In that case, the bad website is an indicator for a good product.

Dwedit•7 minutes ago
AI images (or even Stock Images) of food in a menu are false advertising. Full stop.
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whywhywhywhy•36 minutes ago
Clocked this a while ago, crazy how the smell of the same model they're using is so distinct that entire areas of town are starting to look homogenous.

Someones definitely going to write a think piece about how this erases aesthetic identity of cities and cultures.

Looks like absolute ass too, easily beaten even by something designed by someone completely naive to design/art, good sign of a place to avoid.

ivan888•29 minutes ago
But consider how, in just a short few years, tools will have changed so much that even achieving this specific look will not even be possible (everything is in the cloud and normal users can’t even run them locally)

We’ll inevitably end up feeling nostalgic for these mid-2020s AI slop menus, much like how graphic design of the 90s and 2000s is revered (see other comments on this post) even while during its making was regarded as garish

mathw•7 minutes ago
No we won't.
zer0tonin•15 minutes ago
Somehow in the Netherlands it seems we have mostly managed to escape this. But it's just because people didn't really put any decoration on their menus before, and no decoration is still cheaper than shit AI decorations.
joshstrange•15 minutes ago
Ok, I'll say it. I like the new menu better.

I do not understand the author's aversion. Sure we can talk about "picture of food" vs "what was served" but have you been... anywhere? This is the reality of all food advertisement. I've never in my life been served a plate of food that perfectly matched the picture unless it was a user-uploaded image. Getting a decent idea of what the dish looks like is valuable (especially for unfamiliar cuisine, obviously not unfamiliar to the author but I'd wager unfamiliar to most patrons).

Being anti-LLM/AI for the sake of it is boring. Show me mistakes on the menu or a level of unreality higher than the food industry at large and I'll care but I'm not seeing the problem here.

OtherShrezzing•5 minutes ago
I feel like we read different articles, because without context, the pictured dish looked like overcooked pork chops served next to a type of carbonara tagliatelle topped with a fried egg & chives. I can't imagine anyone has ever set out to make spamsilog and ended up with the generated dish.

It's different in kind to a "my Big Mac is more squashed than the advert on TV" type situation.

mathw•7 minutes ago
Everything looks brown, it's crammed together, those not-photos make it feel really cramped in the third column, it looks like every other AI-generated menu and it's lost the clarity the old menu had.

And yes, there's a very long history of food places using unrealistic images of someone else's version of the food on the menus. That doesn't mean that it's okay to now use LLM versions of the food, because I never thought it was okay to use those stylised photos either.

duskdozer•about 1 hour ago
I think the Japanese laws requiring strict truth in food advertising would be a good transplant.
shibaprasadb•11 minutes ago
The ugly designs are sadly everywhere nowadays. Saw a poster at my gym - gave me the ick!
oeitho•26 minutes ago
I'm starting to see more and more generated images of food at restaurants where I live, but I'm happy to say that its still somewhat rare.

My partner and I usually just give a one star review each on Google when we pass by a place like this and then carry on.

joshstrange•7 minutes ago
Just so I have this clear, you rate a restaurant badly based on the pictures of the food and not the taste/flavor/etc?

These places are doing their best to compete in a cutthroat environment with often razor-thin margins but you are willing to write them off and actively try to harm them for reaching for a tool to try and meet consumer's ever-increasing expectations?

Just like in the native vs electron debate it's not "Beautiful hand-crafted native app" or "Electron wasteful trash", it's "Electron or nothing".

I don't begrudge people at all for reaching for LLM/AI to help cover over what they are incapable of doing or unable to pay other people for. And while "anyone can take a picture" taking good food photography is difficult.

floatrock•about 1 hour ago
We always expect what was promised to be different than what was delivered to some degree, but I'm not sure restaurants have fully weighed the expectations-vs-reality backlash this may cause... uncannily-wrong details aside for a sec, the AI pics always set michelin-level presentation expectations. The final promise-vs-plate pics in this post were pretty dramatic.

There's always a class of restaurants where they don't care about repeat visitors. Think the cafe in front of a major tourist attraction: every day brings a new busload of 1-time patrons, those will always want the michelin-level pics to bait the 1-time foot-traffic in. The danger is the neighborhood mom-and-pops will start using the same trick without understanding they need repeat customers, and repeat disappointment kills a repeat audience.

But who knows... people with a TV budget have been using glue in their cheesy pizza commercials, soap in their beer glass foam, and motor oil on their pancake stacks for a long time -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9k7PJoNAXkk -- maybe this is just equalizing the enshittified food playing field.

xeetzer•20 minutes ago
For now I have the opposite problem. The AI pics look way worse than the food they have, which is unfortunate for mom-and-pop businesses.
fwip•18 minutes ago
I actually had the opposite reaction - the AI image looked grotesque, and the the real food was like "oh damn this looks like good food."
boonzeet•18 minutes ago
It doesn't seem to be as much a trend in the UK - fast food, takeaways etc have some leaking in of AI - but when I went to Korea I was blown away by how many restaurants had these AI style menus.

It's a shame because it takes away the choice of either seeing the real product, or imagining it - I'm left with this shitty generated impression of what the food won't look like.

brap•43 minutes ago
I think if you showed these before/after menus to people from 5 years ago, most would tell you it’s a massive improvement.

But now many of us have been trained to detect slop from miles away so it just comes across as cheap.

I often feel the same way when I glance at a project’s documentation and it’s long and full of markdown styles and emojis: “the author didn’t think about the users at all, they just wanted to get this over with quickly, so now I have to be super suspicious of everything I read here and it might end up being a huge waste of my time”. A few years ago I’d probably think “wow, emojis!”

j4yav•40 minutes ago
Nothing says delicious meal like the liberal application of the AI image piss filter
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account42•11 minutes ago
Honestly pictures in restaurant menus have been pretty bad long before AI. I don't understand how it can be accepted to show a picture that looks nothing like the served food.
tencentshill•about 1 hour ago
I do miss tacky, over-styled menus sometimes. Doesn't excuse the fake food pictures though.
varun_ch•21 minutes ago
I’m ambivalent towards AI generated poster or other business design. It might leave a bad taste in my mouth but it’s whatever. While I’m against it, I can understand why for many businesses it’s an easy and convenient choice.

What makes me feel almost physical disgust is the food in AI generated posters or menus. There’s something deeply uncannily unappetizing about the food. And once I can identify it as AI generated, it’s even worse… there’s something almost creepy about knowing the image is a computers best approximation of something humans want to ingest.

I cannot understand how a food establishment that takes themselves seriously would want to use generative assets like this… can’t they see how unappetizing their own food looks??

qgin•43 minutes ago
There is this new thing where people love to show off their sophistication that they can "spot AI". Every time they see an a Claudeism, every time they see an emdash, they talk about how they feel sick to their stomach and are ready to boycott the business that may or may not be guilty of the high crime of using a computer tool.
hei-lima•37 minutes ago
Yeah, this thought is lame. It's not so bad in other areas, but in food, I would really like to see REAL pictures of what I'm about to order. I mean, "fake" or deceitful pictures always existed, but at least there were real ingredients and so on. I will NEVER boycott some family restaurant because the menu is AI generated, but it is tasteless and I prefer not to see it.
CookieCrisp•39 minutes ago
But don’t you understand! A menu created with AI has no soul!
SirFatty•33 minutes ago
Alex, I'll take "who cares" for 200.
jvanderbot•about 1 hour ago
Hand-made comfort food will be as much a luxury as hand-made menus.
kalleboo•42 minutes ago
It'd be one thing if it was just the problem of a generic AI slop graphic design that all looks the same, the problem is when it generates pictures of food that literally looks disgusting. I've seen some of these posted online where the food literally looks like it's infected (fries with weird black splotches), or the jalapeños look like tires, and it all triggers trypophobia.
TechSquidTV•about 1 hour ago
We have RUINED the food industry. It started with gig-work delivery. Restaurants will never recover from GrubHub and ghost kitchens. Food quality and service died years ago.

Now, they don't have to pay for or manage delivery people, or pay anyone to make their menus for them.

There are no consequences to lying. People have a bad experience sure, but they'll forget next time they order off grubhub and simply search for "burrito near me" and click on the first good looking food.

jdw64•about 1 hour ago
There are a lot of these on websites too. There was a design that was pretty good back in the day, but lately I've been getting quite a few requests to change it to the trendy Linear-style AI design. As more sites use AI-generated images, I think some people have come to see that as the trend
pietmichal•about 1 hour ago
Remember "Hey Look, It's Every Bootstrap Website Ever"? http://www.dagusa.com/
jdw64•about 1 hour ago
Yes, exactly. Bootstrap homogenized layout, and now AI seems to be homogenizing both layout and imagery at the same time.
iamleppert•about 1 hour ago
AI menus and signage are quickly becoming the dog whistle for "cheap". It's telling you what kind of quality and service you should expect in the rest of their product or service. Pretty soon people will catch on, and start avoiding these places. Once that happens, generative AI image models will be hard-pressed to drop the association. It's like walking into a dollar store -- everything can be made cheaply, so it doesn't matter if something there is actually of any value.
datadrivenangel•about 1 hour ago
Except sometimes cheap places are great because the food is good and they don't spend money on ambience and other pretentious expenditures.
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