Omarchy Is a Power Grab

rroboterer 1 day ago 40 commentsRead Article on tante.cc

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Discussion (40 Comments)Read Original on HackerNews

ganelonhb•1 day ago

I have a really cool idea if you’re the type to complain about software you don’t like. You can try this thing called “continuing to not run that software that upsets you.” I do it all the time! It’s quite liberating to not care about nor try to control others!

mindwok•1 day ago

aren't you kinda doing the same thing, trying to control others by pointing out they shouldn't complain?

ganelonhb•about 18 hours ago

There is a big difference in the implications behind my post and OP. OP seems to be implying that anybody who doesn’t raise hell about Omarchy is a nazi. I’m just saying it’s easier to “vote with your CPU.” If a particular configuration of instructions make you think you’re a nazi, just don’t run them.

Here’s a non-political example. I don’t run Duckstation because the developer frequently makes it abundantly clear that he hates Linux users and in recent years has done his best to pretty much ban its use on my distro of choice, Arch (btw). It’s a personal decision that other people just don’t need to know about. Feel free to disagree with me on this nuance, but I think it’s actually more “fascistic” to attempt to forcibly compel people to not run software on ideological grounds.

Tl;dr vote with your cpu. If enough people do it, the software will die. Pearl clutching does nothing but raise buzz around the software that you hate

kazinator•about 21 hours ago

Not really; ganelonhb is pointing out that there is an alternative choice, not insisting that (1) the individual must make that choice and (2) if they don't others must shun that individual and their projects.

znpy•1 day ago

I do the same but you have to understand that some people just can’t get over the fact somebody else has different opinions, different takes on life or software and decide to chart and walk their own path at their own pace.

Btw ggwp to dhh and omarchy’s team.

Ormarchy/arch is not my cup of tea but kudos to them for doing their own thing.

kennywinker•1 day ago

The same could be said about your comment. A take you disagree with can be scrolled past, no need to disagree with it vocally. Yet you did. Because you have an opinion and you felt compelled to share it with others.

Anyway, I am currently using omarchy, I installed it knowing only that dhh was known to be a jerk. I assumed that meant a linus-esque “sometimes yells at people in emails” kinda thing. So sharing this kind of post is actually quite helpful. Because of it, I’ll be installing a different arch variant next time I get the itch to try something new.

undeveloper•1 day ago

you should probably read the article

> And that is why Omarchy matters. Sadly. Not because of its technical merit (even though those fascists love to use the “merit” argument to fight human rights) but because of its leader, his connections and his ability to accumulate financial power. Without anyone in that ecosystem saying anything about how that leader operates and talks. And you might know the saying: If there’s a Nazi and 10 folks sitting together at a table and nobody says and does anything? There’s 11 Nazis at that table.

> Running Omarchy means contributing to this dynamic. It means willingly integrating oneself into a fascist community. Legitimizing it. Supporting it. Omarchy is a fascist project that normalizes fascist thinking for everyone entering that community (even unknowingly). The baseline has to be not to use that system. And as people who believe in human rights and dignity, in community and a tech world that can be better we need to oppose Omarchy. Need to make sure it gets no seat at any table.

bakies•1 day ago

This is a bunch of drama that's so easy to ignore. Publishing this article is just drawing more people to Omarchy. I don't know anything about it and don't care for yet-another-linux-distro-that-does-whatever. It'll eventually settle outside the big three like all other distros.

stryan•1 day ago

It was easy to ignore before it "raised" around 15 million dollars. That's a lot of money to be throwing around a mostly-donation based ecosystem.

I'm already seeing discussions on the mise[0] Github discussions about Omarchy specific changes and designs. I'm not saying anything about these specific changes and they seem mostly distro-agnostic for now, but it goes to show how it can affect other distros/software even if you don't use it.

[0] mise is being sponsored by the Omacon foundation, which is what all this money is technically going to. It also happens to be the only "independent" tool being sponsored by the foundation, as the hyperland dev is essentially contracted by them and the QuickShell dev was hired by DHH.

bakies•1 day ago

It's easy to ignore now.

Are the changes Omarchy specific or distro-agnostic? You say both.

I don't even know what hyperland and quickshell are. I don't use mise because it seems to solve problems I solve with containers.

stryan•1 day ago

> Are the changes Omarchy specific or distro-agnostic? You say both.

The changes are specifically for Omarchy. They just happen to still be distro-agnostic. There is no guarantee this continues in the future.

The discussions:

Using managed tool-stub bundles for Omarchy’s lazy CLI layer: https://github.com/jdx/mise/discussions/12597

Proposal: give every Omarchy user a declarative "my machine" file with mise bootstrap: https://github.com/jdx/mise/discussions/12709

Proposal: give Omarchy dotfiles automatic history, easy restore, and optional sync with mise: https://github.com/jdx/mise/discussions/13022

> I don't even know what hyperland and quickshell are. I don't use mise because it seems to solve problems I solve with containers.

Okay? Your lack of awareness of the tools does not change the fact that 15 millions dollars that is supposed to "support the linux desktop", but right now is mostly funding its own distro.

anklp•1 day ago

People mention the politics, but this is mainly Ruby (and RoR) whoring out itself to AI because Shopify wants their merchants to vibe code websites. Ruby tries to counteract the declining popularity and in my opinion makes it worse. I was on the point of switching to Ruby before I found out about all this AI boosting.

Digital Ocean contributed? Typical nihilist corporation (2021 pandering to Biden):

https://www.digitalocean.com/blog/diversity-equity-inclusion...

treetalker•1 day ago

Team ohm-ARCH-ee vs Team ooh-MAH-chee

armchairhacker•1 day ago

Even ignoring politics, I’m sure there are more impactful ways to spend $18 million. Many OSS projects are underfunded, why not give some of that to e.g. Bevy (https://bevy.org/sponsorship-pledge/), Unsloth (https://github.com/sponsors/unslothai), or better, many small grants to many small projects?

nubinetwork•1 day ago

If these companies wanted to donate to OSS, they would have already. They've made their decision.

diath•1 day ago

You are free to donate your money to your project of choice.

undeveloper•1 day ago

do you have 18 million on hand

tfrancisl•1 day ago

This is such a disingenuous comment. People are allowed to be displeased with how these very wealthy people have spent their money without being told "hrmm, well maybe you should vote with your dollar!!"

mikhael28•1 day ago

Would be awesome if people stopped throwing around the word fascist like it's nothing. I wonder if the person who wrote this had any family members who ran into real fascists during the 20th century. While DHH might be a POS at times, that doesn't make him a fascist.

edent•1 day ago

He's literally calling for ethnic cleansing. What word would you use to describe him?

mikhael28•1 day ago

I do not believe he is 'literally calling for ethnic cleansing', based on what I've read. But if you would like to make that argument, please enclose 2 quotes from him that you believe support your proposition, with a link to the original source.

I would describe DHH as a narcissist. Normal people who don't have a massive ego and hugely inflated view of themselves don't get involved in these societal conversations in the first place, to even be accused of being a fascist.

itsmartapuntocm•1 day ago

"When wolves get out of control, you shoot them. When gypsies take over public spaces, you deport them. This isn't hard, it isn't cruel. It's the basic logic of self-preservation."

https://world.hey.com/dhh/wolves-sheep-and-gypsies-ba44af6a

ivanmontillam•1 day ago

Racist, but not fascist. Fascism is a whole different concept.

kennywinker•1 day ago

Yeah it’s:

> A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, a capitalist economy subject to stringent governmental controls, violent suppression of the opposition, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.

Sounds pretty accurate to me.

gaigalas•1 day ago

> There’s also nothing wrong in more opinionated software

Except the fact that it's a breeding chamber for those "unity and identity" types of people/ideologies/projects?

Embracing diversity is messy, and it's also a blessing. There should be lots of ways of doing the same thing, etc.

undeveloper•1 day ago

i dont believe tech projects have a right to talk about "heritage is duty" and certainly not when the creator has made a point about being a white supremacists. i wonder when he says unity, if he means the non-white he complains so much about explicitly in his article "as i remember britain"

gaigalas•1 day ago

My point is that opinionated software is a magnet for supremacist types and ideologies. It's a nest for their "vision" or whatever.

We're already way past the point of pointing out his character flaws. I want to also point out that as long as we keep this exception the post author made of "ah, there's nothing wrong with being opinionated", these types will use that as a means to push their agenda.

I believe we should aim for the messy, "lots of different ways of doing the same thing" as a clear substrate that embraces all kinds of diversity of ideas and rejects the scumbag ideologies inherently.

dlivingston•1 day ago

Here's DHH directly addressing these claims of fascism / xenophobia / etc. Worth a listen.

https://youtu.be/GYx4OBbswTw

noir_lord•1 day ago

DHH and Lex in one video - that'll be a fun 24:51 of my life I'm sure...

s08148692•1 day ago

This author seems a tad obsessed. 15 times they threw the word fascist around. DHH certainly has some controversial views that many (including myself) find distasteful, but the idea that he will use his funding to suppress and take funding from politically opposed founders and push fascism is nothing short of conspiracy theory.

Use Omarchy if you like the OS. Don't use it if you don't like it. A political analysis of the founders and leadership behind every product you use must be an exhausting way to live your life

froggertoaster•1 day ago

I'm hoping that this is getting upvotes for the obvious and disingenuous use of the term "fascist", which apparently has lost all meaning.

gwt4life•1 day ago

DHH is not a fascist, he is an attention seeker with a reality distortion field. An RDF is of no use unless you say edgy things. The author is being played by writing an article like this. Its exactly what DHH wants.

undeveloper•1 day ago

i dont think its actually important if DHH is really, in his heart of hearts, is a fascist --- what he is doing is spreading white supremacist, anti immigrant, nativist literature -- in combination. i think if you think liberalism (as in american revolution, the english bill of rights, modern democracy, etc) is valuable, you should probably oppose fascism, the ideology of those who reject liberalism and would like to go back.

https://world.hey.com/dhh/wolves-sheep-and-gypsies-ba44af6a

https://world.hey.com/dhh/three-sacred-cows-that-must-die-so...

drak0n1c•about 19 hours ago

Even the most liberal Nozickean voluntary society existentially requires a mechanism to limit granting of membership to those who genuinely uphold its values, and limit intrusion and abuse by those who do not. The literature you linked shows that DHH is cognizant of Popper's Paradox and is willing to defend liberalism from exploitation.

cyanydeez•1 day ago

being indistinguishable from a fascist is, surprisingly, still fascism.

Its like when a couple of nazis show up at your bar and you dont through them out. Welp, now you're a nazi bar.

The real world requires proactive protection from these people. That's reality of where we are today.

ivanmontillam•1 day ago

> Its like when a couple of nazis show up at your bar and you dont through them out. Welp, now you're a nazi bar.

That logic doesn't follow, sorry.

You can be inclusive, yet not become the thing you're inclusive to. That's a mental stretch.

gropo•1 day ago

That's the political crux of this thread.

kennywinker•1 day ago

Including people who are violently un-inclusive is just being violently un-inclusive with an extra step.

Like, there are a lot of world views and opinions that can be included without damaging the space, but nazism is very clearly not one of them. Fascism and the authoritarian forms of communism also fall under this heading.