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#garmin#watch#apple#water#battery#data#watches#usb#don#charging
Discussion (146 Comments)Read Original on HackerNews
If I had a dollar for every time some project that was ipx5 rated failed after getting caught in the rain one too many times...I'd have enough to buy another Garmin Fenix.
Will the UNA hint us with a little bit of fog on the window?
If repairability is one of their selling points, not having spare parts immediately available is a big misstep.
The watch I am wearing right now is a steel automatic that would have an IP69 rating as it’s rated to 150 meters of water depth.
Way beyond IP5X.
Note though that all these watches are water resistant, the seals degrade over time and water can get in. Even the Apple Watch Ultra, plenty of people who had it leaking after scuba dives or even after swimming.
You can usually improve longetivity by following manufacturer instructions (e.g. typically rinsing with tap water after pool or sea use, avoiding saunas/steam baths, etc.).
This is also why almost none of the manufacturers will fix the device under warranty when there is water damage, despite the IP rating.
Even Apple themselvers recommend against submerging and iPhone in water:
To prevent liquid damage, avoid: [...] Intentionally submerging your iPhone in water
https://support.apple.com/en-us/108039
The water resistance in these phones exist so that the phone hopefully survives when they get wet accidentally (heavy rain, pool drop, etc.). Not to shower with the phone, cleaning it by putting it under the tap, or doing underwater photography. Usually, it survives, until the seals fail.
And of course high heat melts the glue (like hot tubs)
The only way to find out is to find someone who bought it and asked for the source code of the OS/firmware and the schematics.
Amazing peace of Hardware.
Also their algorithms are cool. If the watch tells me to rest more than 24 hours, I know, I will be tired the next day.
The two features that I miss are built in heartrate monitor and temperature sensor. I payed around 500€ back then. Over the years I use this watch, the price became very reasonable.
I'm now usually taking the Coros Nomad because it has super-fast maps and still a battery life of three weeks.
They are really great otherwise and I love my Coros Nomad and Garmin Fenix so much more than the Apple Watch Ultra.
It doesn't have all the Garmin features, but it's free and I don't have to worry about it's software getting redesigned.
Also, not everyone with a GPS watch cares that much about heart rate. I am a runner (well, less so now that I used to be, but working on fixing that) and have a Feninx7, not for the health tracking features but for route tracking and the long battery life (for “ultra” events covering many hours or even multiple days).
Seems to me that "still working well after more than a decade of use" is a more useful piece of info than "newer models include additional features".
it has an insane number of features
I see a single unboxing of the watch from three weeks ago on Youtube and zero reviews on YT or websites. Just posts based on their PR release that it's available now. (Though some clearly already shipped.)
Thus, it's unfortunately very likely that the product is also not good at its main purpose, tracking activities, workouts and health. If it would only even come somewhat close to the performance of all the competitor smartwatches/trackers, they'd be louder about that part.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/unawatch/meet-una-the-m...
so it's been out for less than a month. That's why you've seen zero reviews on websites, it's an indie Kickstarter. They don't have the marketing budget of a big wearables brand.
It has a GPS, IMU, and heart rate sensor: That's enough, obviously, to track activities, workouts, and health which their competitors do with the exact same set of sensors. It remains to be seen how accurate those are, or how well the manufacturer and community can develop useful algorithms to turn raw sensor data into activity logs and actionable health insights, but step 1 is to release an MVP to get people wearing the watch and logging data, and step 2 is to use the data to improve the algorithms.
Be grateful it's C++, it could be raw C.
> UNA is currently a non-submersible device due to its innovative modular design. So, swimming is not something we offer as an activity, nor do we advise it. UNA is IPX5 rated, which means it is splash & showerproof to a high degree.
I guess it would be possible to reverse engineer a similar stress level calculation. Perhaps AI-powered?
Garmin has absolutely shitty sleep tracking but it doesn't matter; any wearable more or less nowadays can get static heart rate correct, leading to more or less accurate recovery metrics.
"Collect every paper you can find on RHR/HRV/etc. recovery metrics. Develop an algorithm for predicting recovery score per day based on the research" as a prompt to a Codex or Claude agent can probably get you 98-100% of the way there.
Edit: As a proof of concept, I had ChatGPT Pro 5.6 write the algorithm with my Fitbit data. Looks great.
My body battery and stress often starts declining for no apparent reason and then 12-24 hours later I feel the symptoms of an illness. Similarly, when in a tough training block, HRV is a great tool to gauge how hard I ought to be able to go: I've tried to push through and just do a tough workout anyways when it's out of range, but failed to complete the workout in good form, or felt superficially crappy but had good training readiness according to the watch and was able to do better than expected.
The same holds true in the other direction, I don't log into Connect or scroll through the multitudinous widgets of data often enough to really keep tabs on this stuff, and when I get sick or feel good or bomb a workout or succeed at a workout when I felt off, the metrics consistently back up the actual results.
Personally, I've been thinking about jumping ship to a Coros Apex 4 if my battered Fenix 6 ever gives up the ghost - Garmin's prices are insane these days. At $270, this is cheap enough in comparison to a $1200 Fenix 8 Pro to take the chance. I could buy this and a $480 Apex 4, and then decide I didn't like either of them and go back to a used Forerunner 955, before spending as much as a new top-end Garmin.
The newest watches seem insanely priced though and don't seem to add much. But the newest Enduro with decent solar is tempting
and post-2020 Garmin has totally lost their way with development/algorithms
What might be cool for a version 2:
1. Custom hardshell "door" to cover the USB-C port. Something that cannot fall off the watch. The port itself could be well sealed like a phone and then have this additional layer of physical protection.
2. Wireless charging of some type (or even add pogo pin as well). Would be nice to top up charge without having to expose the USB-C and probably increase the plug life. Does this require a glass back? Because obviously that would not be ideal in a watch.
3. Better waterproofing. I dont personally use my Garmin for swimming often but would be nice to not have to worry about it.
Anybody know about the battery life in real world use?
But IPX5 is definitely a show stopper for my kind of usage
Just put it on your wrist.
You CAN decide to use garmin-connect for apps/updates or pair it with your phone, but I never have and I'm fine.
Apple watch and others require activation.
My Fenix 6 Pro has a 47mm face, is 14.7mm thick, and weighs 80g (but as a Fenix that's the stainless bezel one, the plastic bezel watches are closer to 50g).
https://unawatch.com/products/una-watch
It's been a fragile piece of hardware, I am on my 3rd one in as many years (always replaced under warranty though), but I still probably wouldn't switch to anything else. When it breaks out of warranty I'll just buy another one.
My Garmin Epix watch is practically bullet proof. I've dove with it in open ocean. I've jet skied with it. I rock climb with it. It's surived 108miles of Unbound (the race) in mud, sun, sweat. I've water rafted with it. I've swam in crappy lakes, streams and jumped off cliffs. Hottubs? also no problem.
Zero chance a iWatch would ever survive these conditions.
Oh and despite all of this, the screen has not scratched, not even a little. Plus it has 5-10 days of battery life... and did I mention I always have a flashlight on me?
Mine survives such things just fine.
My Garmin Epix watch is practically bullet proof.
And your Epix cost about twice as much as the Una watch does.
I believe this the least!
I also don't see why an Apple Watch wouldn't survive all those mentioned things. Pretty sure I did all those things with an Apple Watch on, except for the specific 108 mile gravel race. But I don't see why it would fail that.
And both might absolutely scratch while climbing, and if you're unlucky and hit it in the wrong spot, also crack.
That said, if I were an athlete in any of those categories and did it all the time, I'd still absolutely choose a Garmin.
I wonder what HR sensor they use. Samsung apparently has an average error of 7% which is pretty bad, so I wonder if this would be worse. [0]
[0] https://www.cnet.com/tech/mobile/i-ran-30-miles-testing-5-sm...
USB-C charging would be awesome, instead of Garmin's proprietary plug and a cable that's made from spider silk. I'd prefer, though, wireless charging like Apple. Never once have I pulled an Apple Watch off a charger and said, "WTF? Why didn't it charge?" Garmin, OTOH...
I'm no triathlete, but the "no swimming" kinda puts a damper on my enthusiasm as well.
I wish them well, I love the idea even if I probably won't buy one.
Whereas I throw my Apple Watch in the general vicinity of the magnetic charger, it locks into place, and charges just fine, 100% of the time. Fine, don't use induction like Apple, use two exposed, flush pins and a magnet like my Coros armband HR monitor, because that works 100% of the time, too.
Apple certainly doesn't let you.
My goal is to have a cron that runs on my homelab that pulls my health data into a DB I own, from various sources, and visualize it in Grafana.
There are several apps[0] off the top of my head that pull data from Apple's HealthKit. Apple even has a framework for it: HealthKit. That said, I've never written to that API myself, but it observational evidence indicates that you can pull data from Apple just fine. The app I use to pull data off Apple and ship to Strava says as much.
[0] RunGap and HealthFit
>Gone are the days of brand specific charging cables.
Returned are the days of worn-out, broken ports and searching for another charging cable.
So it’s an important differentiator from Garmin, which uses a proprietary connector for its charging cable, that is easy to lose/break and expensive to replace (from personal experience with a 2022 Epix).
Yeah, if you only use the stock Garmin cable (why isn't it at least right-angle?!) it kinda sucks, but there are lots of products that do it really well:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0F5L632HM
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0D4F71WQC
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07N18DX6Y
I would much rather these totally waterproof surface-level pads that put the spring pogo pins in the cable than give up internal device volume to a USB receptacle or magnetic charging coils.
But a watch, something people will wear swimming, sweaty, in the rain, etc, is something that should ideally follow the wireless charging standards, and not have a plug taking up space, and being a spot for leaks...
I doubt that modern smart phones are waterproof. Who would trust use their smartphone while showering or being in a bathtube (including submerging the smartphone a few centimeters into the water)?
I remember when the iPhone 7 had just come out (the first waterproof iPhone), a friend bought one and then went on a cruise. On a shore excursion he was at the docks and saw some cool fish. He dunked his phone in the water to take some cool photos. Everyone looked at him like he was a mad man, dunking his iPhone in the water just to take some pictures.
Might this be it?
Also, any watch right now should be waterproof, it won’t survive otherwise.
Round watches are bad. A circle is the worst shape for watches. Good watches are not round. Roundness is an anti-feature.
Really. Just use a rounded rectangle shape. It will end up _smaller_.
Very valiant first effort for sure but after 6 years with a Garmin Fenix still holding 90% of its battery (and being able to replace it), I'm not their potential customer.
What kind of battery life did you have when you bought it, and how long is it now?
Does Garmin still upgrade the firmware?
Good thing with the Fenix line is that you stop the updates which I did a year in so I don't really care about them, but I do think they stopped firmware updates for the 6series about a year ago.
But you'd be a fool to believe a hardware startup would do so anyway.
I by now often see the term "surveillance capitalists"/"surveillance capitalism" on HN.
While it is a great thing to fight surveillance organizations, don't forget that communist countries had/have (for the latter: People's Republic of China) much worse surveillance in place.
https://commandlinux.com/statistics/developer-os-preference-...