HI version is available. Content is displayed in original English for accuracy.
Advertisement
Advertisement
⚡ Community Insights
Discussion Sentiment
74% Positive
Analyzed from 3664 words in the discussion.
Trending Topics
#germany#more#energy#solar#https#prices#electricity#kwh#nuclear#europe
Discussion (122 Comments)Read Original on HackerNews
> https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c78gn8zvrx4o
I'm near Graz, in Austria, where we're also in the middle of a drought and in truth I can't remember a summer as hot as this one...
I watched a report that has an interview with the CEO of a cereal factory. They get all their wheat via barges. He said they already paid €100k extra this year for low-water surcharges for shipping and that they'd need 6,500 trucks annually if they'd replace the barges with trucks.
Today the all-time record in Austria was broken with 40.8°C (105.4°F) in Vienna.
> https://www.krone.at/4242196
https://weatherkit.apple.com/alertDetails/index.html?ids=081...
I'd describe it a little differently myself.
Dro(a)ught monitor: https://www.ufz.de/index.php?de=37937
Extreme Heat Has Transformed What Summer Means Across Generations in Europe - https://www.nytimes.com/2026/08/01/world/europe/europe-summe... | https://archive.today/XsX2m - August 1st, 2026
Europe’s Heatwaves Are a Taste of the Climate Costs Yet to Come - https://www.bloomberg.com/news/newsletters/2026-07-27/europe... | https://archive.today/AqWba - July 27th, 2026
Why Is Europe Warming Twice as Fast as the World Average? - https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-06-26/europe-he... | https://archive.today/o68OH - June 26th, 2026
You'll find articles about every single land mass "warming up faster than average"... that's because the average include the 70% of the planet that is covered by oceans, these don't warm up nearly as fast as landmasses. We're all pretending we'll manage +1.5c or +2c by 2050, and in the average Joe's head that not much, in reality we're already fucked, July was +4c above normals in France, and we're in 2026 not 2025.
Australia is Warming Faster than Global Average: https://www.statista.com/chart/20404/mean-annual-temperature...
China warming faster than global average: https://www.chinadaily.com.cn/a/202607/02/WS6a462fd5a310986e...
Europe’s warming accelerates beyond global trend: https://defence-industry-space.ec.europa.eu/europes-warming-...
Warming in Brazil is already higher than the global average: https://www.wwf.org.br/en/?90683/Climate-Warming-in-Brazil-i...
Africa is warming more rapidly than the global average: https://www.cseindia.org/africa-is-warming-more-rapidly-than...
And yeah, my read is that this is more arguments in favor of: it doesn't matter which way CO2 evolves, we'll need to take control over the climate if we want cities to remain where they are.
What's next? "BaCk iN mY DaYs SumMeRs WeRe HoT ToO" ?
I imagine you don't intend it like that, but last month killed an extra five thousand people in Germany alone [1], more than one thousand of them in a single day [2].
"People may have died and the economy may be in trouble but my summer was amazing" is not the best take.
[1] https://www.dw.com/en/germany-june-heat-wave-linked-to-5000-...
[2] https://datawrapper.dwcdn.net/gvL9c/4/
Or some US america who does not get fact that this context is talking about German Energy and the European heat wave and Fahrenheit is not used any metric in this part of the world. I considered especially rude that you assume the reader should convert the value though Fahrenheit is mostly used in USA.
Throughout the winter, wind is a bit more random but causes spells of high prices and spells of low prices.
The main thing causing electrical usage prices to be high in Germany is grid charges for the gigantic grid infrastructure buildout.
Germany's electrical grid is one of the most resilient and interconnected in the world, and it's rapidly being upgraded to accommodate the huge build-out of wind, solar, and batteries that is underway. I agree that the government should probably shoulder more of these grid-costs to take some burden off of major industrial users.
I do agree though, that even just having 'normal' energy prices for a developed nation makes it very hard to be an industrial powerhouse.
IMO the only way forward is for Germany to build more energy infrastructure. Most importantly, we need more solar wind and batteries, but we also need upgrades to gas peaker plants, and more long-distance HVDC connections to neighbouring countries to better smooth out variations in weather that are inherent to intermittent renewables.
Doubling down on fossil fuels won't bring down Germany's energy costs.
Either, you are not from Germany or your example is a clear MBA-101-Bobo-Textbook example :-D
PL: ~21ct/kWh
LX: ~20ct/kWh
AT: ~19ct/kWh
NL: ~19ct/kWh
BE: ~17ct/kWh
FR: ~16ct/kWh
DK: ~9ct/kWh
Germany: 23ct/kWh (or: about 25% higher than the EU average)[0]
Of course Germany "is mostly in line" if your ideology depends on it.
[0] https://cubeconcepts.de/en/europes-industrial-electricity-pr...
Energy may well be cheap in the US but you have been paying for that for decades through military misadventures in the middle east.
Texas is probably our national leader in terms of deploying solar and wind power, which feels ironic but is totally rational and logical.
80% of solar panels/batteries/windmills are made in China. We wouldn't even be able to make them without fossil fuels in the first place. Not even talking about the electronics that is needed
This is in stark contrast to fossil fuels, where it's infeasible to stockpile more than a few months of usage, and if suppliers turn off the tap, you're at their mercy almost instantly.
If China stopped supplying solar panels or batteries, it'd spark a frenzy of activity and demand for locally produced replacements, and there would be enough time for those to come online.
"Green" supporters prefer renewable energy, because it allows you to build a resilient and distributed network of production, distribution and storage that can't be easily disrupted by any one shock event at the fraction of the cost of nuclear (if you count subsidies and government financed research, not even considering the socialization of insurance against accidents).
Solar panels? They gotta fix the brain drain first. Anyone with the capability to bounce understandably does.
The only people with money are Israeli and Qatari real estate investors.
They do. One of the odd fringe benefits of agrovoltaics is that the plants beneath the panel slightly lower the panel temperatures through transpiration.
https://energyfactbook.com/world/electricity-prices-by-count...
Whether it is the best mechanism to incentivize a transition towards renewable energy sources is debatable, but OP at least implies that we’re on the right direction.
At some point we will have enough renewables to turn off the old and expensive gas and coal plants. Until then we just have to live with the feeling that it’s an investment towards future generations.
Perhaps humanities biggest flaw is to prioritize instant gratification over long term benefits.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AAA_battery
12B KWh = 12M MWh = 12,000 TWh?
12B kWh = 12M MWh = 12k GWh = 12 TWh.
And as a sidenote, why do people downvote a question rather than answer it? Some of us like answering questions and deadening a question removes that ability.
The American way of handling units is always surprising.
if its just [dead] (no [flagged]), as the case with tyromaniac, that's automated by the site (suspected spam/ai/bot/etc.).
the comment can be vouched for to lose the [dead] status by users with 500+ karma (i think? maybe 1000)
comments don't gain [dead] due to downvoting.
>What does [dead] mean?
>The post was killed by software, user flags, or moderators.
"moderators" isn't referring to just anybody with a downvote capability? They mean just the website owners, e.g. dang, etc.?
In these scenarios, using more (renewable) electricity actually has no net effect at all, as it is purely from additional production, which is only available because you use it. I live in a region in Germany with a lot of wind and solar and I regularly see my PV plant be capped by the local energy company and the wind turbines around my village standing still despite a stiff breeze. Every kwh I use from my own PV in this case is free energy in the most expansive meaning of the word.
> The IWR explained that Germany’s Renewable Energy Sources Act (EEG) operates on a differential cost model for new photovoltaic systems. Under the mechanism, electricity generated by solar installations is first sold on the power exchange, with the resulting market revenues credited to the EEG account. Only the difference between the market price and the statutory feed-in tariff is compensated through the EEG account.
Wait, this is still being subsidized by taxpayers? And Germany has some of the highest energy prices in Europe?
I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. On the one hand folks are happy to tout solar and wind as "the cheapest energy you can get" and on the other we have the market realities of what consumers and taxpayers are paying. There's a policy failure somewhere if the cheapness to produce energy this way is not being reflected in the market and subsidy structure. Does anyone have an analysis of wtf is going on?
And it worked very well, as it started the global solar boom. Because it's not necessary anymore as an incentive, it's slowly getting phased out.
The Einspeisevergütung is not the reason why consumer electricity is expensive in Germany, though. That's more related to our grid.
We are still paying for renewable energy projects agreed in say 2016 for ten years or indeed 2006 for twenty years. The "cheapest to produce" is a fact about new energy not about what it still costs us for things we agreed to in the past.
I don't look at German data but I do stare at UK data a lot and the model isn't so different. In 2015 this country finished "Allocation Round One" of the current mechanism for these subsidies. Offshore wind farms got about £120 per MWh [in 2012 prices] in that auction and by 2016 the first of these wind farms was running. £120 per MWh isn't a good price by today's standards even if it wasn't in 2012 money, but we have to keep paying that price for those wind farms because that's how deals work (unless you're Donald Trump)
This year, in "Allocation Round Seven" offshore wind auctioned for about £65 [still in 2012 prices]. That's still not a great price today, the Solar farms are significantly cheaper, but given that the afore-mentioned Tangerine Palpatine caused gas prices to shoot up this price is actually not uncompetitive. However, that power doesn't actually exist today, the auction was for rights those wind farms will get built over the next year or three and the £65 per MWh power won't be lighting my home until about 2028.
I agree that nuclear should not have been phased out at the very least until coal was gone, but don't make up shit and say that they made up for the nuclear exit by burning more coal, that is untrue. Germany made up for it by building more renewables.
In addition, without the Greens-pushed and initiated renewables subsidies, there would have been basically no big market worldwide for solar manufacturing to even be built out the way it was and all solar tech and industrialization would likely not be as good as it is now.
Are you referring specifically to a German political party?
Because that's a lot of credit to attribute to a single party in a single country.
It might be well deserved, but seeing some supporting data would be nice.
It's true, though. Emotions seem to be clouding your judgment. Renewables could've been replacing coal. Instead, they're making up for the lost nuclear capacity.
I agree if coal was banned before nuclear, the new renewable capcacity added could have done more to replace a huge source of emissions faster. It was a failure of education, media, and political will that Germany phased out nuclear before coal.
That does not however mean that coal usage increased after nuclear was phased out, such a claim is just false.