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Discussion (43 Comments)Read Original on HackerNews

sva_44 minutes ago
So at the heart of this architecture is what they call 'Markovian RSA', a combination of two papers RSA[0], which generates a certain amount of reasoning traces for a prompt; and the 'Markovian Thinker'[1] which seems to basically cut the end of those traces to keep context at a reasonable length.

I feel like there's potential to improve that part of just cutting a tunable amount (τ) of tokens off the tail end of those traces, because you may potentially lose valuable insight earlier in the trace? They did train the model (in SFT) to put the relevant information into the tail (τ) of the trace, but I'm not sure this is the best possible way.

0. https://arxiv.org/pdf/2509.26626

1. https://arxiv.org/pdf/2510.06557

throwaw12about 4 hours ago
> The math and coding part is impressive but the agentic one is not.

I think this is very important to eventually become a viable replacement for coding models. Because most of the time coding harnesses are leveraging tool calls to gather the context and then write a solution.

I am hopeful, that one day we can replace Claude and OpenAI models with local SOTA LLMs

2ndorderthoughtabout 3 hours ago
It's pretty close already. Check qwen3.6 27b if you haven't already. People are vibe and agentic coding with it on a single GPU.

It is more finicky than Claude but if you hand hold it a bit it's crazy.

gchamonliveabout 3 hours ago
I see that going around, and either the test cases are too simplistic or I'm doing something wrong. I have a server with a 3090 in it, enough to run qwen3.6, but I haven't had much luck using it with either codex or oh-my-pi. They work, but the model gets really slow with ~64k context and the attention degrades quickly. You'll sometimes execute a prompt, the model will load a test file and say something like "I was presented with a test file but no command. What should I do with it?".

So yeah, while it's true that qwen3.6 is good for agentic coding, it's not very good for exploring the codebase and coming up with plans. You need to pair it today with a model capable of ingesting the whole context and providing a detailed plan, and even then the implementation might take 10x the amount of time it'd take for sonnet or Gemini 3 to crunch through the plan.

EDIT:

My setup is really as simple as possible. I run ollama on a remote server on my local network. In my laptop I set OLLAMA_HOST and do `ollama pull qwen3.6:27b`, which then becomes available to the agent harnesses. I am not sure now how I set the context, but I think it was directly in oh-my-pi. So server config- and quantization-wise, it's the defaults.

simjnd39 minutes ago
This link [1] features some good insight on how to adapt your usage to smaller models which require more explicit or deliberate prompting. I have been using Gemma 4 31B a lot and have found it very competent. It can be a bit unstable and start spiraling or end up in infinite loops that you need to reset, but for the most part it's been really good.

[1]: https://itayinbarr.substack.com/p/honey-i-shrunk-the-coding-...

mark_l_watson26 minutes ago
When you run ollama serve, make sure you override the context size to about 32K. Also, I give the model a useful short README.md on the code it is writing or modifying, and a Makefile with useful targets for the agent to use. I usually use Claude Code with qwen3.6

I also go outside for fresh air while I wait for a session to run.

dminikabout 2 hours ago
Yeah. Context size matters a lot. With OpenCode dumping like 10k tokens in the system prompt it takes like 4 rounds before it had to compact at say 64k. It's not really worth it to run at anything below 100k and even then the models aren't all that useful.

They're also pretty terrible at summarization. Pretty much always some file read or write in the middle of the task would cross the context margin and it would mark it as completed in the summary. I think leaving the first prompt as well as the last few turns intact would improve this issue quite a lot, but at low context sizes thats pretty much the whole context ...

embedding-shapeabout 3 hours ago
You're not sharing what quantization you're using, in my experience, anything below Q8 and less than ~30B tends to basically be useless locally, at least for what you typically use codex et al for, I'm sure it works for very simple prompts.

But as soon as you go below Q8, the models get stuck in repeating loops, get the tool calling syntax wrong or just starts outputting gibberish after a short while.

pferdoneabout 2 hours ago
I can see that and I don't know your setup, but there are people pushing >70t/s with MTP on a single 3090, with big contexts still >50t/s. 64k is not a lot for agentic coding, and IIRC 128k with turboquant and the likes should be possible for you. r/LocalLLM/ and r/LocalLLaMA/ are worth a visit IMO.

EDIT: just found this recipe repo, may wanna give it a go: https://github.com/noonghunna/club-3090

EDIT-2: this can also shave off a lot of context need for tool calling -> https://github.com/rtk-ai/rtk

2ndorderthoughtabout 1 hour ago
I see your updated post. Switch over to llamacpp and look up recommended quants and settings. A good place for this info is on /r/localllama
nixon_why69about 2 hours ago
Qwen3.6 supports 266k context out of the box. Try using q8 kv cache to enable more of it.
2ndorderthoughtabout 3 hours ago
I agree for planning it's not there yet. But I wouldn't be surprised if something came out that was in a similar weight class.
regexorcistabout 3 hours ago
Try oh-my-openagent plan mode.
pizza234about 2 hours ago
Vibe coding on consumer hardware is still very limited; this is especially true on GPUs, whose RAM limit is around 16 - maybe 24 - GB for the vast majority (although Macs change the equation).

These are two realworld experiments, whose results are disappointing for those expecting levels of performance comparable to cloud services:

- https://deploy.live/blog/running-local-llms-offline-on-a-ten...

- https://betweentheprompts.com/40000-feet/

The first is even the 35b version of qwen3.6.

2ndorderthoughtabout 2 hours ago
I don't see how it's disappointing? 95% correct using the 35b model before the right quants came out on a laptop? And they still got tons of code written for them.

On a real GPU using 27b with the latest quants the experience is better. It's still not the same as opus running on a subsidized GPU farm. Well it is better for privacy at least.

I find it interesting how 2 people can read the same thing and come to very different conclusions.

iugtmkbdfil834about 2 hours ago
Eh. It is good in terms of results ( accuracy, good recommendations and so on ), but slow when it comes to actual inference. On local 128gb machine, it took over 5 minutes to brainstorm garage door opening mechanism with some additional restrictions for spice.
2ndorderthoughtabout 2 hours ago
I find it hilarious how waiting 5 whole minutes to design software is considered slow in a way that people refer to as not useful. My god lol.

Is that 128gb RAM or VRAM?

steveharing1about 3 hours ago
That's absolutely possible, its just as we move towards more advancement, We'll soon see Small models being smart enough to not be judged by parameter count but their reasoning and intelligence. You can see examples like Qwen 3.6 27B.
regexorcistabout 3 hours ago
Yeah this is key, a lot of people are still just looking at the number of params and thinking these models are toys. What Qwen 3.6 has shown is that reasoning and tool calling are just as important if not more.
yorwbaabout 3 hours ago
adityashankarabout 2 hours ago
I used their online api, and asked it to create code for a timer i can copy paste into about:blank to test out (prompt below)

it did it successfully, but it did need a follow up correction prompt, overally pretty impressive for a model with 760M active parameters, but definitely not deepseek-r1 level

that being said, if something with 760M active parameters can be this good then, there's a good chance it is likely that api-based models are likely to get cheaper in the future

Prompt ------

``` can you write me some js code (that i can put in the console for about:blank) which will basically create a timer for for me that i can start, stop, and store current values for (or rather lap)

so i want it to create buttons (start, stop, lap buttons) on the page for me with labels and divs and other elements that accordingly record the current information and display the current information, and can accordingly start, stop and lap :)

the js code that i copy paste automatically creates the html buttons and divs and other elements that can manage the timer and accordingly the timer works with them ```

Havocabout 3 hours ago
0.76 active and it's vaguely competitive at coding sounds promising.

LM studio doesn't let me actually run this yet though: "Unsupported safetensors format: null"

2ndorderthoughtabout 4 hours ago
I've been saying it for a long time now. I think small models are the future for LLMs. It's been fun seeing experiments to see just how much better models get by making them insanely large but it's not sustainable.

No I am not saying this model is a drop in Claude replacement. But I think in 2 years we might be really surprised what can be done in a desktop with commodity hardware, no connection to the internet, and a few models that span a subset of tasks.

Really happy to see amd put their hat in the ring. It's a good day for amd investors. I know a lot of AI bros will scoff at this, but having your first training run is a big deal for a new lab. AMD is on their way despite Nvidia having years of runway

zimi-24-imizabout 3 hours ago
using C was 100 times as productive as assembly. what happened was not that we finished software 100 times faster, but that we did projects 100 times bigger in the same time

same thing with smol local LLMs versus the big ones in the sky. your smol local LLM will only be able to tackle projects which are not comercially valuable anymore, because people expect 100x scope and features. which is fine as a hobby/art project

yes, we'll do amazing things with local LLMs in 2 years, but the big LLMs will do things beyond imagination (assembly vs C)

2ndorderthoughtabout 3 hours ago
I disagree. I think people can make very good software by balancing their use of AI and their market knowledge. I still believe for the foreseeable future people can make wildly loved or mission critical software with 0 ai and have it be met with market interest.

I think we are going to see a surge in software claiming to do everything and becoming bloated and unsustainable.

I already see 1gpu local models 1 shotting games via vibe coding. I see people doing agentic programming, granted more slowly and cheaply than 12 Claude sessions.

The difference isn't as big as it was 2 months ago. In the past 45 days so many model releases have happened. Meanwhile frontier performance has stagnated and degraded. If it's a taste of what is to come I welcome it.

hparadizabout 3 hours ago
I'm like two months into a vibe coded C project. My issues are the same as ever. How to pack memory. What syscalls to run and when. Is the program stable after running for 24 hours? When I want to make a change it's usually a trade off with something else. There's no accounting for taste among humans. Let alone among an LM. It's great at implementing my ideas but terrible at coming up with those ideas. Architecture is always going to be king.
steveharing1about 3 hours ago
You couldn't be any more right!
zimi-24-imizabout 3 hours ago
but he could be absolutely right
steveharing1about 3 hours ago
He could be right but time will tell if we can really achieve that level in open source space because as you know Even in open source space companies go closed when they achieve something really efficient and frontier. I'm not talking about all but that's usually a pattern