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#wikipedia#more#https#windows#search#category#doesn#file#system#click

Discussion (122 Comments)Read Original on HackerNews

cube0025 days ago
This is really impressive. It's exactly what I imagined the original Microsoft Network in Windows 95 would have been like.

And so The Microsoft Network wasn't a program you loaded like CompuServe. It was part of the OS, with folder icons that looked just like real folders. It was a kind of version of the Web where you could browse online data the same way you browsed your file system. This is what made it cool.

It was as if the data was suddenly free of the shackles of being displayed in a program. Data wasn't just a web page, or a program showing its own internal databases. The Microsoft Network made it look like the data was right there, and you could click it and drag it around! For a brief time, back in 1995, it felt like we were on the verge of the true object-oriented web, a world filled with open data and free from the tyranny of the walled gardens.[1]

It also reminded me what an excellent job Wikipedia does with their hierarchical classification which you don't see when you're often only searching by article name.

[1]: https://web.archive.org/web/20260129143542/https://www.coder...

pocksuppet25 days ago
Talk about data being separate from programs always reminds me what a good job Microsoft did with the spacial filesystem (that means one folder is one window, and they remember their location), single-document interface (a UI paradigm) and COM (a cross-process communication system). As a novice user not understanding a whole lot about the system, your documents were in the operating system and not in a specific program (this still wasn't perfect and a lot of new users did think their documents were in programs, which might be why we gave that up) and those programs could talk to each other and embed each other's documents.

This stuff probably seemed moderately innovative if you didn't grow up with it, seemed blindingly obvious if you did grow up with it, and somehow, like idiots, we've managed to lose it again!

funimpoded25 days ago
> this still wasn't perfect and a lot of new users did think their documents were in programs, which might be why we gave that up

To this day there exist office workers—ones old enough that no, it's not because the were introduced to computers via smartphones—who use a computer for hours every single weekday day but get totally turned around in a file manager, and don't know even the extreme basics like how to copy and move files.

There are offices full of such folks, in non-tech offices, where the person who knows how to sort-of use a GUI file manager is the "computer whiz" they go to with questions.

keyringlight25 days ago
The "files and folders" hierarchical tree model for a file system is one where I wonder about the limits or effectiveness of the skeuomorphism approach to convey such a concept. If you're coming from a place where information was generally held and organized on paper, it _should_ be natural that you can group files within a container like a folder, and the kind of folder the iconography showed should be able to contain sub-folders.

While many did pick up on the idea, where were the shortcomings? Were the early graphics not enough to build the mental link. Was it the common grid view of icons. Was it the icon being an abstract thing you needed to open to see the contents instead of looking at it directly (as previews on the icon which came later), was it things opening in separate windows. It's not as though other more visually 'rich' methods to show a file system such as 3D or animated took off.

There's also the modern version that gets brought up occasionally where people who are using devices with mobile instead of desktop OSes apparently don't know how to work with file systems to manage data, and presumably they'd have even less exposure to the physical paper concept that inspired it.

pocksuppet23 days ago
I think people think this way because they create a new Word document by opening Word. If the only way to create a new document was to right click -> New... -> Word document (a menu that already exists) they'd instantly "get it". That system is intuitive to everyone - there's nothing not to get.

Once you understand how that works, then additionally understanding the new/save/open buttons is trivial, but if you started with the new/save/open buttons you might not get how they work because you'd have to lose your existing wrong understanding. Learning is path-dependent.

anthk25 days ago
OLE objects are just FAT like filesystems; nothing too disimilar to Unix if it mounted disk images with text files and different images with it in order to create a document format.
crazygringo25 days ago
> It also reminded me what an excellent job Wikipedia does with their hierarchical classification

As someone who once tried to use that supposedly hierarchical classification for data organization, it is unfortunately not excellent at all.

It is rather arbitrary, inconsistent, extremely incomplete, and not infrequently circular. Think of it more like a bunch of haphazardly applied tags that make perfect sense in the context of a single page, but quite frequently make very little sense when you look at the actual pages and sub categories that belong to a category. Category membership is just not something visible enough for it to wind up being organized and curated in any kind of systematically accurate way.

On the other hand, the presence of an infobox of a certain type is extremely reliable for categorizing many types of articles.

TuringTest25 days ago
> They had this project called Cairo that was supposed to throw out that scruffy old file-based filesystem and bring in a shiny new Object Based File System instead. It never happened, so we'll never know exactly how it might have turned out.

Nowadays we call those APIs. They are REST based rather than file-based to make them distributed, the main difference is that you don't get a common user interface that all providers adjust to; you need to choose your own client to read them and write into them.

And because they're created by programmers for programmers, they're not what you'd call user-friendly. Usually the only efficient way to use them is programmatically, so that you need to create a specific user interface for each API. Somehow, I doubt that Cairo would have come to be anything much different from that in the end.

pndy25 days ago
Somehow this reminds me of https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19249373 released by CERN on 30th anniversary. Pretty sure Berners-Lee in recent years was contributing to decentralized web/Internet concept that does also reminds a little bit of early WWW.

There was also this submission from 9 years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13361523 - and probably not the only one of such ideas

Digit-Al24 days ago
Are you mabe thinking of Solid[1]? This is an interesting idea, and I have looked into it on several occasions recently, but despite it being around for a really long time it appears to be going exactly nowhere, unfortunately.

It seems a bit of a missed opportunity really. If they had more agressively pursued alliances, it could potentially have been a solid (pun only semi intended) foundation for Mastadon and Bluesky.

The name is unfortunate as well, it is really difficult to search for.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solid_(web_decentralization_pr...

pndy23 days ago
I dug around my bookmarks and now I remember what had in mind: IPFS and Beaker, and ZeroNet along with Solid. And it really seems none of that is active enough to gain any interest.
zozbot23425 days ago
> This is really impressive. It's exactly what I imagined the original Microsoft Network in Windows 95 would have been like.

That's actually not far off. It was an old-fashioned BBS like Compuserve in a Windows Explorer-like window. The topic-specific icons you see in this mockup are actually very on-point, though on the Microsoft Network they would be for general BBS sections not encyclopedic articles or media.

dwedge25 days ago
That really sounds like the idea behind Plan9. Interesting.
hliyan25 days ago
Incredibly beautiful, possibly because it maps so well to the mental model we typically use to organize knowledge in our heads. I don't know how we lost the folder/container vs. document/content iconography, and other things (like layout of items, sorting) during the shift to web applications.
cheschire25 days ago
Knowledge doesn’t neatly align to a nested hierarchy. Especially written knowledge.

Language is an imperfect means to convey knowledge, and people store that knowledge in subjective and highly personal ways.

You may mentally recall balloons within “entertainment” or “party”, whereas I might store that knowledge under “horror”.

Add onto that the massive focus on using graph theory to scale social networking technologically, and you effectively lose any motivation for rigid hierarchy.

darkwater25 days ago
A folder system doesn't have to be strictly rigid, you can still have "symlinks" so the same article appearing in different folders (aka labels if you can easily duplicate content inside folders, but you retain the nested, drill-down approach)
fleabitdev25 days ago
Wikimedia Commons has this feature. Editors can manually bless certain combinations of traits as "subcategories".

For example, https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Paintings_of_cas... contains the subcategories "Paintings of castles by country" (nested hierarchy), "Frescos of castles" (a medium), "Paintings of Château de Chillon" (a subject), and "Young Knight in a Landscape by Carpaccio" (multiple views onto a specific item). Each item may appear in multiple subcategories. As far as I can tell, the UI won't let you search for frescos of Italian castles (unless somebody's made a subcategory for that), or view all paintings of castles regardless of their subcategory.

I'm not very fond of this approach. I'd prefer for each item to have an unstructured set of tags ("fresco", "depiction of a castle", "depiction of Italy"), with automatic derivation of parent tags ("fresco" implies "painting") and the option to search by multiple tags. It should be possible to automatically discover tags which best refine a search, so that the UI can still suggest them to the user, as it does today.

bawolff25 days ago
> Knowledge doesn’t neatly align to a nested hierarchy. Especially written knowledge.

The category tree being displayed comes directly fron wikipedia. E.g. Wikipedia has pages like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Art

jerf25 days ago
Which isn't a hierarchy, it's a tagging system. The tags have some hierarchy but that's not uncommon. The distinguishing characteristic of "nested hierarchy" is that a particular thing should only appear exactly once in the hierarchy.

Since this is so terribly impossible most systems almost immediately make it possible for things to show up in more than one place, which means it's actually hierarchial tagging, whether or not the organizer(s) realize it.

You could also make a distinction based on how many tags things end up with; if it's almost always one, you could call it a nested hierachy with some exceptions, but if it's almost always more than one, and often much, much more than one, it's a tagging system. Even by that criterion that creates a spectrum rather than a binary distinction, Wikipedia is very much organized by tags and not hierarchies. I don't know what the average is but every Wikipedia page I've ever looked at the tags for has quite a few.

agilek25 days ago
Yes, and it sad the search in this UI doesn’t work…
9x3925 days ago
I agree, for some reason I have always alternated between wanting not just the universal search box but a browsable hierarchy to mentally run my fingers over and discover in a structured way.

We let go of the the manual index somewhere along the way since it doesn’t scale like search, obviously, but for the same reason I keep a library and enjoy traversing others’ private ones and visiting public ones, I keep coming back to browse.

sznio25 days ago
I guess this model doesn't maximize engagement
queuebert25 days ago
This is why I frequently post about how I miss Gopher. It kind of forced this hierarchy.
jasonfarnon25 days ago
Did you prefer the Yahoo/internet frontpage approach to google search though? I didn't, but I remember a time when it was a live debate. It has been interesting to see some sites like youtube or wikipedia evolve a quasi-hierarchical frontpage though.
queuebert25 days ago
I did. I made my own custom start page back in the day with frequently used searches, along with headlines, weather, stocks, etc. Instead of menus, it just divided topics using horizontal rules, much like an actual newspaper.
chuckadams25 days ago
I dunno, I never had a "Sheep Looking at Viewer" category in my mental model until I randomly clicked around the media folder.
jwr25 days ago
Large scrollbars! Windows with borders! What a relief!

This has become a forgotten art: we focus so much on CONTENT these days that we forget that people want to use the mouse to scroll, and use the mouse to resize windows.

__natty__25 days ago
I agree. We focus on content where usually it’s so poorly structured and displayed it lacks final touches. I prefer wider scrolling bar than extra white space in the browser. Same goes for finder. I find old systems to be much more usable for me than modern ones
lukan25 days ago
Hm. It is a clear UI, but I would prefer more space for the content.
dewey25 days ago
The shininess looks a bit more like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_XP_Media_Center_Editio... and not like the regular Windows XP, but still a fun project!
chuckadams25 days ago
Definitely not MCE: the title bars are bright blue with the "Fisher-Price" orange buttons, which was the hallmark of regular XP.
AMerrit25 days ago
Yeah it's def going for an XP clone feel. Although it's not 1:1, I assume to skirt copyright.
lavela25 days ago
I feel like the 100 or so uncategorized articles should lie either directly in home or clutter the desktop for a more authentic experience.
crabmusket25 days ago
Where does the hierarchical classification come from?
brynnbee25 days ago
I did something similar for my personal site :)

https://brynnbateman.com/

cousin_it25 days ago
I lasted less than one minute. Can't read anything when there's an unstoppable animation in peripheral vision going blinky blinky blink.
brynnbee25 days ago
Taking about clippy? If so that's good feedback! I'll make it disappear after a couple seconds. Thanks!
eur0pa25 days ago
Beautiful memories of browsing random topics in Microsoft Encarta '97
sagacity25 days ago
This is genuinely a really fun way to browse Wikipedia. Only drawback is that folder names that contain ellipsis don't show the full name when clicked.
hellosami25 days ago
If you click on the tile icon at the top of the window, you can have it display as a list!
Uptrenda25 days ago
Somehow the format makes me feel like its easier to learn here than the intimidating encyclopedia theme of wikipedia. It's interesting to consider the effect that presentation of information might have on learning. We know that physical books are said to be better for learning (I have heard people go up by an entire grade if they use them), but maybe there is something to be said for themes, too.
moffkalast25 days ago
Ok this is a genuinely perfect way to research an entire field by article instead of having to jump recursively link to link and forgetting what you were doing 5 minutes ago.

I've never seen wikipedia from this categorized vantage point. If we're being real their UX is kinda crap outside the usual search->article->link flow and could use a complete rework.

Kim_Bruning25 days ago
Lucky 10000?

Three tricks if you didn't already know:

1: you'll find categories at the bottom of regular mediawiki pages

2: if you click one, you'll end up on a page like eg. this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Computers

3: the tree style tabs plugin in combination with middle-click is criminally underrated for navigating hierarchical data. (middleclick open-in-new-tab is only mildly handy, tree style tabs seems tepid by itself without it)

moffkalast25 days ago
TIL, I think I've landed on these pages a decent number of times but never from wikipedia's internal nav. I assumed they were more of an adhoc occasional thing, not a standard for sorting all pages.
Kim_Bruning25 days ago
Oh, right, and I forgot about the tree views!

The little arrows next to the subcategories can be clicked to open up trees, so you have hierarchical data in there as well. Try click open eg Classes of Computers (With 41 direct subcategories, and 91 pages directly in the top level category, that's a big tree!)

Categories are criminally under-used.

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unrvl2225 days ago
love how it loads instantly and feels smooth. imo useless but still cool
dolmen25 days ago
Yes. It definitely lacks the hourglass mouse cursor experience!
kristianp25 days ago
> love how it loads instantly and feels smooth.

Unlike Wikipedia these days.

hexagonwin25 days ago
wikipedia is fine, and you can still use vector or even monobook skins. try adding ?useskin=monobook at the end of the url
dewey25 days ago
Is this sarcasm? Doesn't Wikipedia look identical to 10 years ago and still load instantly?
kristianp24 days ago
It doesn't load very fast at all for me. Maybe they don't use a cdn close to my region, but each page load for me feels very sluggish.
senfiaj25 days ago
I guess XP (x64) could run like this on modern PCs.
angilr25 days ago
It is nice. I randomly click on something interest just appear in my mind and lead to this: life -> death -> last_words -> More milk. But I can't find it on Wiki. I search More milk. and the first result is this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Michael_Jackson. Hmm, why is the name different?
flexagoon25 days ago
"More milk" is a redirect to that page

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=More_milk.&redire...

The "Windows XP" website displays the same article when you click on "More milk" there

angilr25 days ago
Wow, do you know what is the relationship between More milk and the death of MJ?
Kwpolska25 days ago
The Wikipedia article does:

> After several hours and several drug injections, Jackson was still unable to fall asleep, and, according to Murray, was repeatedly asking him for "milk", a nickname for the powerful surgical general anesthetic propofol, which Jackson had used in the past as a sleep aid. At 10:40 a.m., with Jackson still not asleep, Murray relented to his requests and injected him with 25 milligrams of propofol diluted with lidocaine. With Jackson finally asleep, Murray testified that he left his bedside to go to the bathroom, and after returning two minutes later, discovered that Jackson was not breathing and had a weak pulse.

DeathArrow25 days ago
Well, it should also have Solitaire and Minesweeper. :)
bovermyer25 days ago
This is fantastic. And I really appreciate that it doesn't pollute my history API with a bunch of exploration marks.
blks25 days ago
It’s too snappy for a windows xp experience.
tigerlily25 days ago
Oh wow, to me the history section feels like Civilopedia (in a good way). I can't explain why.
redox9925 days ago
Is there a reason why it looks like Temu's Windows XP? Copyright concerns I guess?
Gualdrapo25 days ago
Not sure why they downvoted you because you have a point - icons are not the same as Windows XP's, wallpaper flat color reminds me more of Win 95/98 and the taskbar design has some details that do not match precisely with Windows XP's. I'd also bet it's due to copyright concerns
freshollie25 days ago
Probably cos it's vibe coded?

The main CSS comes from XP.css [0], but the AI additions [1] have definitely messed it up in some way.

The whole thing is pure JS which is nice but the comments give a good impression isn't not hand written IMO [2]

[0]: https://github.com/botoxparty/XP.css/

[1]: https://explorer.samismith.com/css/base.css

[2]: https://explorer.samismith.com/js/explorer.js

weezing25 days ago
Ask LLM to make a 98/XP styled website and you will discover the reason.
sunaookami25 days ago
Because it's obviously vibe coded (look at the source code).
person325 days ago
Having used Windows XP this bothers me because it's just slightly off.
arnon25 days ago
make it look like encarta 95 and you'll have a REAL winner on your hands
maxglute25 days ago
Neato. I will never understand how microsoft settled on that vomit teal.
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macwhisperer25 days ago
pretty cool! needs the search function to work tho to be useful
neutralx25 days ago
It kinda stays true to the Windows File Explorer as its search was always mostly useless
OkGoDoIt25 days ago
I’m surprised the search function in the start menu doesn’t do anything. Seems like that would be super useful. But I did enjoy this, nice job with the polish.
ZoomZoomZoom25 days ago
This is cute, but the UI is uncannily not there (I think there were multiple attempts of designing the XP for web already which looked more authentic).

But my biggest gripe is, why represent it as a file system with WordPad displaying HTML? I get the idea for media, but not for the articles.

It's pretty obvious that Wikipedia should be a single CHM file. That would be nice and much more immersive.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Compiled_HTML_Help

klaussilveira25 days ago
CHM files were great, it actually made documenting enjoyable. I miss those days.
underlipton25 days ago
There seems to be some editorializing in category choice, which makes this a bit of a no-go for me. I'll just use the real thing.
dustinroepsch25 days ago
This is what Rocky brought home to the Eridians
woodydesign25 days ago
This is so Cool! Great concepts and execution. I could imagine this way of interaction and exploration apply to Educational area
kramit128825 days ago
This looks really cool. feels nostalgic. it would be more fun if it can be switched into whatever desktop mode i want like unix.
kanswam25 days ago
Wikipedia has come a long way since they started where anyone can go in and update the pages without having it verified...
Eonexus25 days ago
This is just beautiful. I wonder if this could turn into different styles, like that of a book, or a cabinet?
steveharing125 days ago
What a beautiful nostalgic feeling. Keep up the good work! Worth adding some start menu options as well.
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soupspaces25 days ago
Is there a way to go up/back a folder without clicks? Enter key goes into folders.
jdw6425 days ago
Seeing the Windows XP theme I loved the most really brings back a wave of nostalgia
pixlmint25 days ago
Such a cool project! Now it's just missing search and a request for donations
emil-lp25 days ago
It's also missing the defrag tool. Without it, it's going to be very slow as the disk fills up.

Should put a shortcut to it on the desktop as well, so that users who experience significant lag can defrag at will.

nickburns25 days ago
Okay, okay... *enables JavaScript for explorer.samismith.com*
jan_Sate25 days ago
That's pretty fun to play with. Whoever made it, good job! :D
basilgohar25 days ago
Windows XP's desktop rendered as a web page is snappier.
sharts25 days ago
This is kinda not dissimilar to old school 90’s yahoo.com.
jovial_cavalier25 days ago
I really want a linux virtual filesystem that does this.
MK2k25 days ago
this needs to be an offline bootable usb version :)
koolala25 days ago
trying to find what folder has Дэбі робіць Даляс
bawolff25 days ago
Presumably none, since its only searching english wikipedia, and that looks to be belarusian.
koolala24 days ago
I don't think most things are ever limited to one language like that. Also, Hacker News doesn't let you delete your own comments?
bawolff24 days ago
idk, it appears this thing is, since after clicking around a few times it becomes very obvious all the content is english. Guess that is just how the author of this project decided to make it.

Generally you can delete your comment if its relatively soon after you posted it and nobody replied.

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solarized24 days ago
beautiful. please change doublr click to single click when open the folder.
ShinyLeftPad25 days ago
Honestly, a testament to current Wikipedia design, because while it's fun to click around it's literally impossible to find what you need in this kind of GUI. (Geofile explorer is simply baffling.)
Yajirobe25 days ago
What does Wikipedia do differently? I don't think I have ever used Wikipedia's internal navigation - if I want to find something I usually type 'XYZ wikipedia' into Google and click the first link.
ShinyLeftPad25 days ago
I often use category links on the bottom or in the sidebar when researching. Also I use search, which doesn't work in this alternative GUI. Sometimes I check the article in another language.
hnlmorg25 days ago
I guess appearance is subjective because I always considered XP to be the ugliest Windows ever released.
sjreese25 days ago
Impressive, I will use it
peppevignanello25 days ago
This is actually so cool
a1o25 days ago
Can I run this offline?
jimmydddd25 days ago
Thanks! This is great.
guilhermesfc25 days ago
Super nice. Congrats
rigonkulous25 days ago
I'd like to see a gource interface to Wikipedia, personally ..
ernstgnzlz25 days ago
Amazing work!
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piyiotisk25 days ago
what tech stack does it uses?
dunderd25 days ago
Very cool!
gargola_25 days ago
It doesn't work for me. Nothing clickable opens anything or do anything for that matter. Am I the only one experiencing this?
fstepho25 days ago
I love it! Congrats !