Back to News
Advertisement
Advertisement

⚡ Community Insights

Discussion Sentiment

24% Positive

Analyzed from 1709 words in the discussion.

Trending Topics

#party#mullvad#sweden#immigration#https#don#swedish#controversy#free#born

Discussion (43 Comments)Read Original on HackerNews

JLO64about 11 hours ago
Personally, I'd rather not have a company I work for police my social media and political activities just so that they fit with what the company desires. That would make me quit as I value a separation between my personal and work activities.

That said, the fact that the person involved is the founder of this company (not a regular employee) does change things though. I don't know anything about the politics involved, but (with the exception of recent American executives) I would imagine you would want the people who run your company to be more neutral as to prevent controversy (or at least do so quietly).

panarkyabout 11 hours ago
I don't want the founders and operators of my free-expression tool to be neutral.

I want them to be strongly biased in favor of free expression.

But they take my money and use it restrict how people dress, how they pray, what customs they are allowed to follow, what they teach their kids.

The agenda they support is anti-free-expression, and that's worse than neutral.

teravorabout 11 hours ago
it was a mistake to respond, over 90% of the controversy is performative as it nearly always is. the ideologues will posture and claim that they are dropping mullvad while being unlikely to follow through.

most people wouldn't even know the controversy happened nor care. with the response, you now trigger various human instincts that draw attention, promote further gossiping and wondering where the fire is with all the smoke.

sapphicsnailabout 9 hours ago
I'm really sad about it but I'm not going to renew Mullvad once the 6 months I already payed for are up.

I'm fine supporting companies that have people with poliical views I initially interested in Mullvad for political reasons and one of the founders giving a significant amount of money to a political group that wants to restrict the rights of other people is too much for me.

Not everyone is cynical. Some of us have actual values we act on.

dijitabout 8 hours ago
Its worth considering that this is a left wing populist party that doesn’t like immigration, and what was actually said (the major controversy) is that even if you are born in Sweden, if you commit crimes and do not make any effort to be Swedish: you probably shouldn’t be here.

How this is represented by people is different than that, and its hard for people who don’t speak Swedish to listen to the original sources, but be assured that in Sweden there is an actual party founded by Nazi sympathisers and it is the second most voted for party.

I get not wanting to support someone you think has immoral views, but check the facts first before blacklisting a company that is filled with people trying to push for a more open, private yet transparent internet.

letmevotepleaseabout 10 hours ago
A mistake from a public relations perspective, but I think taking an explicit stance against deplatforming and self-censorship is consistent with Mullvad's stated mission.
calldacopsidgafabout 11 hours ago
"Mullvad will continue to keep its values and mission separate from the broader views of its founders." - the sentence immediately following a link to Daniel's soapbox blog post
gnabgibabout 12 hours ago
Related: I'm Done with Mullvad (65 points, 14 hours ago, 175 comments) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48975428

The CEO of Mullvad is the main financer of the Swedish Örebro party (118+695 points, last month, 3+1588 comments) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48687508 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48717469

t-vanabout 11 hours ago
Who is the most trusted VPN provider now?
Cider9986about 11 hours ago
Mullvad, IVPN and Proton VPN are all trusted so choosing depends on your priorities with the small differences between them.

https://www.privacyguides.org/en/vpn/

Obscura by definition is the same or better than Mullvad because of the multi-party relay. Similar with iCloud Private Relay but that's only for Safari which is inadequate.

Nym looks promising but mixnets haven't been tested as much as the Tor network.

kivleabout 10 hours ago
Proton VPN had their own controversial episode earlier this summer:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48446899

Cider9986about 9 hours ago
I don't think what happened with Proton was controversial.
viccisabout 10 hours ago
I don't see how that particular political expression is a risk to their VPN's stance. This is a lot of nothing; would have been better to ignore the screeching from Bluesky.
sxpabout 11 hours ago
For those unfamiliar:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%96rebro_Party

The party has been variously characterised as left-wing and right-wing, as well as populist, nationalist and conservative.

  Some key issues for the Örebro Party locally include strong secularism, a 30-hour workweek with retained pay, lowered wages for politicians, expanded social housing, abolishing preschool-fees, making public transport free of charge,[3] ending taxpayer funding of what it sees as wasteful sculptures, monuments and art and introducing free dental care.[4][5] Nationally the party has set out large-scale remigration, closing the Swedish borders to immigration, a stricter assimilation policy and ending taxes on energy and fuel as some of its key issues.
The message from the CEO about the donation: https://dberntsson.info/

And for those who may not be old enough to remember the last time this happened in the techsphere: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brendan_Eich#Appointment_to_CE...

sapphicsnailabout 8 hours ago
"Large-scale remigration" is quite the euphemism for "violently remove people in the country from their homes and send them to God knows where."
EA-3167about 11 hours ago
It sounds like the usual far right bottom line dressed up with a bunch of “Free Pizza” promises to cover it with a veneer.

Personally I wish people like his had the balls to stop hiding behind that kind of thing, we all know what someone is about when “immigration is the main problem” in their viewpoint.

Own it. Or if it’s something to be ashamed of… accept the shame.

ai_criticabout 10 hours ago
Failure to recognize immigration as a problem for a sizeable chunk of the population--rightly or wrongly--ensures that they will fall pray to demagogues and will never again trust those who repeatedly blew them off.

Progressives fuck this up continually across the policy spectrum, by having no answer other than "no you're wrong/immoral/stupid" to people who express concerns in categories that have strong orthodoxy requirements.

OkayPhysicistabout 10 hours ago
That's because they are wrong, immoral, and stupid. They're grovelling in the crumbs left over by the rich, and then getting pissed that there are other people groveling for the same crumbs.

Blaming immigrants is easy because you get an immediate base amongst racists (the immoral). They'll perk up at the sound of your dog whistles, and immediately start barking shit like "finally someone had the bravery to say what we're all thinking". That amplification of your message then reaches the reactionaries, who accurately look around at the world that is hell bent on destroying them, but are a little too dense to understand the web of systems that make up that world, and thus are eager for a simple explanation (the stupid). And once your message gets embedded in the zeitgeist from that lot, normal, relatively detached from politics people start hearing all this talk about immigration being a problem, and believe it (the wrong).

The same way you can't be frugal to make up for making poverty wages, you can't shrink the pool of disadvantaged workers to make them advantaged.

viccisabout 10 hours ago
Not really, this looks more like pre-1990s leftism that you see from people like Caesar Chavez. Broadly redistributive policies towards the working class and a strict curbing of immigration as a source of exploited labor underclass for corporations to fatten their margins. There's a reason Bernie called open borders a "Koch brothers proposal".
OkayPhysicistabout 10 hours ago
There is a very, very, very large gap between "open borders" and "keep all those disgusting foreigners out". I guarantee if you ask the average "immigration control activist" in most countries what the acceptable number of brown people to let into their country is, the answer is zero. Because the most active members of these movements are motivated by racism.
0xyabout 11 hours ago
Only in Europe could a party with socialist-leaning values on every single issue except immigration be branded 'far right'. This is the case in every single European country for some reason.

Marine Le Pen's party in France leans socialist on econ but is painted as 'far right' for the same reason.

slopinthebagabout 11 hours ago
The Nazi's were full on socialists, I think it's more that the left-right spectrum is too binary to describe many parties political views.
OkayPhysicistabout 10 hours ago
Congrats on falling for hundred year old propaganda. Fascism loves dancing around in the flayed skin of the socialism it violently represses. Go look into what they did to trade unions if you think the Nazis were some Worker's Party.
slopinthebagabout 9 hours ago
The Nazi’s were National Socialists, which is very obviously different from Marxism-Leninism, and was/is a very specific kind of evil. You can’t divorce the National from the Socialism, and that’s not my goal.

Go look into what the soviets did to trade unions.

bigyabaiabout 11 hours ago
> We have nurtured a culture of radical tolerance.

Play radical games, win radical prizes. The last place I want my money going is towards radical authoritarianism, a cause that I thought Mullvad would thoroughly oppose.

> Self-censorship out of fear is an even bigger dampener than direct censorship.

Bullshit. Self-censorship is a self-preservation mechanism, a VPN doesn't change the consequences of saying illegal or offensive things. Direct censorship is an abuse of the monopoly on power, and much more inhumane than just feeling insecure about your edgy ideas being attached to your identity.

cryzingerabout 11 hours ago
The "radical tolerance" thing is also a little ironic, since the biggest controversy with the party that the founder donated to is that the party isn't tolerant of people from different backgrounds or nationalities...

[insert Paradox of Tolerance quote here]

dijitabout 10 hours ago
Tolerant is the wrong word to choose because tolerant doesn't mean "accepting" it means... to tolerate.

And the most extreme position they have stated is that "it doesn't matter if you're born here, if you commit crimes and don't respect the culture you should probably leave".

That is an extreme position, but it's not as black as people seem to paint it, which implies heavily that the party is just simply racist against non-swedes.

The actual racist party is the second most voted for party in Sweden, I think because of how intolerant the society has been about talking about the issues caused by migration. That is my own opinion though, as a migrant, living in the city with the most migrants in Sweden.

pstuartabout 10 hours ago
> don't respect the culture

That's where it gets messy, at least in the States.

note: I have family in Sweden that are non-white but I've never discussed the issue as it felt a bit too "delicate"

bsoupabout 10 hours ago
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%96rebro_Party#Immigration_...:

'In 2026 Örebro Party leader Markus Allard sparked controversy on several occasions. In a debate hosted by Studio3 with Liberal member of parliament Martin Melin, Allard asked: "why won't the Liberals push for deporting 100 000 social welfare-Somalis?" and in the same debate said that "Sweden belongs to the Swedes. We have to make sure that we take care of our own damn people and we must deport these damn parasites who sit and live at our expense."

In a podcast segment about immigration and deportations Allard stated his opinion and said that "They will also be forced to leave, even if they are born in Sweden, because they have no natural connection to Sweden. They are not Swedish."'

dijitabout 10 hours ago
It's nice to cherry pick inflammatory things that have been stated without their full context.

The context in this case is that he was directly asked:

"What about the people born in Sweden who commit so many crimes and do not integrate at all, live their whole lives on welfare, as we are seeing in the statistics it is mostly the second-generation who are most represented" (I am adlibbing and translating, but this is the question).

Allard then said, as you put it: that being born here is not protection.

Now, that is an extreme position, nobody else would say such a thing, and to be totally clear: it's not possible in the Swedish constitution to strip someone of citizenship (even if they have a claim to another by blood- which is the most common method of attaining any citizenship btw) - it's also against international law to strip someone of a citizenship to leave them stateless.

However there's only 30,000 people (of 2.1M) foreign born people in Sweden whom are otherwise stateless (Palestinians; Balkans who did not reapply after the fall of Yugoslavia), and there is a huge issue with crime and integration.

There are no solutions, but it's kind of valid for Swedish people to be looking at people to ask difficult and stomach-churning questions in some way.

_defabout 10 hours ago
> We want to liken Mullvad to a force of nature. Or to cryptography. It just mechanically does its thing with no human arbiters.

I can't even find the right words to describe how wrong this sounds to me