The Nature of Dance

wwonger_ 2 days ago 24 commentsRead Article on vester.si

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xfeeefeee•about 1 hour ago

Dance is such a nuanced thing. Really I think it is more like a language than anything else.

My favorite example of this is at somewhere like a rave or Phish show etc where you can see people form their own little conversations and groups and move on as the night goes.

And of course you have people just enjoying having a nice talk with themselves and the music.

In more professional settings you see people try to fit dance into little boxes and say what it is or is not... it predates spoken language. It is something very primal, not even uniquely human.

embedding-shape•40 minutes ago

Dancing in large groups with other humans truly is primal, and something special. It's akin to the experience I think people get when going to church and similar things, weirdly enough.

Everything is so artificial online today as well, that maybe it's the contrast between what we see all day vs when we're at events, that make it all seem extra special nowadays.

gilleain•13 minutes ago

Going to church, you say? :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ltoAcZrjBw

(Faithless : 'God Is A DJ', Live at Alexandra Palace)

adzm•35 minutes ago

Before I went to my first Phish show I always heard people refer to it as their church; it didn't make sense to me until I went. Even being sober, it was a very powerful experience, and the sense of connection and community was very enlightening.

embedding-shape•32 minutes ago

Never went to a Phish show, but now you got my interest up :) I'm mostly coming from the electronic music scene, in various capacities, and pretty much the same feeling and senses exposed in those, even in more "artificial" music styles.

I feel like a lot of the "AI-doomerism" could be solved if people go out where large groups listen to music, and dance together with strangers. I even wrote about one recent experience in more detail some weeks ago: https://emsh.cat/en/the-people-are-still-there/

srean•about 1 hour ago

https://divisbyzero.com/2009/05/04/the-maypole-braid-group/

Of maypole dance and the algebra of braids

noelwelsh•about 2 hours ago

When I think about dance, it's about the algebraic structure in it. E.g. translating moves between different levels, transitions between moves, and so on. That, and the movement options that increased physical capabilities unlock. So nothing like what OP thinks about. Not a criticism of what they've written; just a different perspective.

srean•about 1 hour ago

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49694659

noelwelsh•27 minutes ago

It's most obvious in very formalized dance, but even in street dance, which emphasises freestyling, you can still find this kind of structure. There are videos of bboys talking how they come up with moves, and they'll talk about applying transforms (reverse, invert, change level, etc.) to existing moves, or combining parts of existing moves together. It's very far from everything in the dance, but it's a useful lens to guide exploration.

An example video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCpXbHpy9LY

plastic-enjoyer•about 1 hour ago

Once again, I’m not at all surprised that tech people can’t simply enjoy the activity for its own sake, but instead impose their calculating, utility-driven mindset on something that is truly beautiful and brings people together. An absolutely bleak perspective.

embedding-shape•38 minutes ago

> tech people can’t simply enjoy the activity for its own sake

How is this possibly your take away from someone describing how they see something? You know nothing about this person, yet conclude they have a bleak perspective, yet you're the one who is criticizing someone for merely thinking and talking about an activity.

Let people enjoy activities in the way they want. If they want to endlessly analyze and discuss the mechanical details about it, or if they just want to stand on the top of a roof in the rain and dance, who cares? They're both "enjoying" the activity, just in different ways.

TFNA•23 minutes ago

The OP's ridicule does make sense. Think about how in Star Trek TNG, Data's description of everyday hobbies and pursuits in logic-speak was used to lend humor to episodes, "Haha, he's so weird". And people often say now that character was a better depiction of an autist than a far-future android.

TFNA•42 minutes ago

I wouldn't knock neuroatypical people's attempt to overcome their faulty wiring and do something that could socially benefit them, even if the perspective they are doing it from is strange. RMS has spoken about how getting into Bulgarian folk dance was good for him.

noelwelsh•about 1 hour ago

Don't tell me how I should enjoy my hobby.

robertacion•about 2 hours ago

I found quite interesting the apps the author created for dancing: https://vester.si/blog/dance-tools/

However I could not figure out which partner dances he focuses on, I would be curious to know.

vesterde•17 minutes ago

Several, but as the other comment pointed out, Urban Kiz is my main focus, as well as Tarraxo and Zouk.

amelius•about 2 hours ago

Looks like he's into Urban Kiz (I suspect a kind of Kizomba, which is quite popular in Europe).

Note: the author is also on HN. He made this:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49649789

vesterde•6 minutes ago

I did not expect my weekend and week to be spent on the first page of HN, let me tell you.

alansaber•about 2 hours ago

"Dance clip" seems to do exactly 0 things I can't already do with the video editor/folder system on my phone.

embedding-shape•37 minutes ago

And dropbox is merely SCP/FTP, yet there they stand.

high_na_euv•about 2 hours ago

>Learning styles aren't a thing*. It was an idea popularized many years ago - that some people learn by seeing, some by hearing, others by thinking about things , etc... - and has been so thorougly proven not to replicate that when teachers use it to promote their methodology I practice my breathing exercises to not let it get to me.

What???

Ppl definitely learn by various means.

Im reading it wrong or what?

vesterde•8 minutes ago

I agree, and actually I put that asterisk there all that time ago when I wrote that article intending to put a footnote at the end, and clearly forgot. I meant to say that yes certainly people don't learn in the same way, but the thing I'm averse to is someone saying "I learn by seeing", and leaving it at that. It's simplistic, and I've found that individuals can also be wrong about their own opinion if their learning style.

The way I read some of the literature is that these may more often map to preferences, so the individual may prefer to see things, when learning, but it might not actually lead to more learning happening.

In dance I would yield that some people can repeat a movement just by seeing it, and others can't, but again I would say that's a learning style, I'd say there's a capacity inside them that is less strong/developed, translating movement seen to movement done. And it can be improved.

phrotoma•41 minutes ago

In my day job I am an instructor. It has become fashionable of late to shit on the idea of learning styles for various reasons.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learning_styles#Criticism

chrisjj•about 1 hour ago

Means != styles.

https://onlineteaching.umich.edu/articles/the-myth-of-learni...