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50% Positive

Analyzed from 1035 words in the discussion.

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#claude#language#using#words#llms#author#something#examples#etc#while

Discussion (27 Comments)Read Original on HackerNews

nater5000about 1 hour ago
I was pleasantly surprised when I attempted to scroll down and realized everything the author wanted to present fit on-screen. It's almost ironic that this site is able to make such an obvious, compelling presentation without being overly verbose or complicated (something which LLMs have a hard time doing). I wouldn't read TOO deeply into what is being presented, but the author has done a good job to not inject their own bias into the presentation which works well.

I suspect, as we continue forward, humans will slowly start to adopt the language of LLMs, or at least certain language quirks that come from interacting with LLMs. Something I've noticed in my own writing is that I now present lists of examples in a consistent way: "... such as <example 1>, <example 2>, etc., ...". I started to notice I was using this pattern quite a bit somewhat recently, but I took a quick look at some of my social media posts and realized it's been occurring for a while. I had realized that I grown accustomed to this kind of language because, especially early on, LLMs would focus too much on the specific examples I'd provide when, really, I was just trying to give them a sense of what I was looking for. I just picked up that providing two examples then adding the "etc." worked to get the LLM to not focus so much on the specific examples and to understand that they need to consider more than what I explicitly presented. Of course, now I write like that in my social media comments, in Slack with my colleagues, etc. :>

I'd be interested to see if anyone can identify trends like this, since I think the human-language component of the adoption of LLMs is probably being somewhat neglected despite probably being surely dramatically affected.

Labo33342 minutes ago
Author here :)

Thank you for the compliment! I did spend a lot of time designing a nice experience on both desktop and mobile. Even the scrollbar to select words was non trivial as I wanted the words to be of different size, yet avoid flickering when scrolling!

sosull19 minutes ago
I really love this. It’s comprehensive, it consolidates the data to the point where the argument effectively ‘makes itself’, and the way it’s presented respects the reader’s time. It also makes for an interesting challenge (for me at least) to try to characterise the subject matter of a language problem so narrowly.

No ream of slides. No narrative. Just a lovely big painful conclusion.

jimmaswell14 minutes ago
> the argument effectively ‘makes itself’

What argument? I don't know what to take away other than "Claude likes certain words". Some of them are kind of amusing, but I'm not convinced the vocabulary is bad or that this is a problem.

tel8 minutes ago
[delayed]
Labo33317 minutes ago
Thank you so much! The presentation was really my goal here, more than the model itself.
clbrmbr19 minutes ago
@labo333 do u think soon we may need a dictionary? ive been playing with something u may like, but my approach has been to ask for definitions in-session so hard to do from outside.

https://www.themachinevernacular.net/

glimshe19 minutes ago
I had an idea for an experiment. Take a decent text, any one, and ask AI to rate it. Then patch that text by replacing words for ones that AI likes (honestly, load bearing etc) whenever possible and ask AI to rate it again to see how the evaluation changes.
MrDrDr30 minutes ago
I find Claude language often hard to process and having to wade through these words can be draining. Embarrassingly, I’ve recently caught myself using them in conversations! Do all models have the their own jargon?
fnyabout 1 hour ago
While Claude's style is obnoxious, I'm more frustrated by its inscrutable explanations.

You need a PhD to understand its explanation of a code snippet.

Labo33339 minutes ago
I'm not even sure a PhD helps. It just overuses jargon that has NO meaning. Sometimes, it actually hand waves too much as well while trying to dumb down stuff for you.

I am not sure whether it's a consequence of learning to reason from its traces or some RLHF that trips it into using weird terms to sound smarter to the humans who rate it.

fny6 minutes ago
PhD was a joke.

My intuition is that Claude is trained to communicate to itself while coding. You see this in how bizarrely granular it is when explanation prior work, you also see this in the comments it leaves behinds.

black_knight22 minutes ago
I have a PhD and can confirm. Oftentimes, the stuff which comes out of Claude is just impenetrable because it invents jargon on the fly, and uses verbs in the most atrocious ways.

"The fibred side folded its capstone into the existing name, so the kinds are asymmetric."

What on earth does it mean to fold a capstone into a name‽

fouc19 minutes ago
don't forget LLMs are great at translating between languages, and within the same language. depending on the problem it works on, it will often reach for terminology that tend to be more common or familiar within that problem set. which appears inscrutable, but there's many different ways to skin a cat. just remind it to translate it back to the terminology and subject matter you're already an expert in.
dave1999xabout 1 hour ago
Is it the obnoxious style that causes this?
condiment21 minutes ago
I think it's the hierarchies of agents summarizing each others' summaries before presenting a final answer to the user. The principal agent has the full context from all its workers, but when it distills this down to a message to the user it summarizes it into a mess of confident jargon that pertains to a conversation the user wasn't a part of and never saw.
Labo33327 minutes ago
Author here! Grateful for the kind words, human communities like HN really hit differently when you spend the whole day chatting with sycophantic and bullshitting agents (including to make this).

I'm currently adding a search bar as well as increasing the data to 1000 PR per day.

A nice thing that is not obvious on the main page is that the dataset and analysis are updated daily using Github Actions (at least when they don't suffer from an outage ^^). I find it pretty cool to be able to build such apps without a "backend"!

srousseyabout 1 hour ago
I'm surprised vacuous is not on the list.

The word selection and way of writing has taken the joy out of using Claude.

user4392820 minutes ago
I'm also missing the "latch" that "wedged" my test run.
confusedbucketabout 1 hour ago
That confirms the recent spike of Claude calling everything I was recently working on a 'spike'. I still don't know what that term is supposed to represent (apparently).
Kwpolska31 minutes ago
In some software development methodologies, "spike" is a task whose goal is figuring something out instead of delivering shippable code. https://agiledictionary.com/209/spike/
Espressosaurus24 minutes ago
Why can't they call it a prototype or experiment? Sheesh.
MaxwellM42 minutes ago
Really spectacular analysis – thank you for sharing, fun to scroll and easy to understand.

Is it possible to expand this analysis beyond words to other Claude ticks? Contrastive framings, sentence length, caveating, for instance.

Labo33335 minutes ago
Author here, thank you so much! I really tried to make it nice to use, beyond the (quite original) modelling.

A prototype I did tried to detect some grammatical constructions, eg "it's not ..., it's ...", but I am not sure how to systematize that.

Also just a disclaimer: I am NOT tracking Claude tics, I am merely finding that a particular cluster of vocabulary increases. Tracking Claude requires labelled data IMO. I tried using model release dates in a structural model to constraint the clusters but the result was not compelling, so I ended up simplifying the model a lot!

customguyabout 1 hour ago
Thanks to the infinite well of human creativity I am able to read "load-bearing" both as the intended affectation (I won't call it meaning) as as well "being full of shit".
Labo33330 minutes ago
That was the intention behind my title!
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simlevesqueabout 1 hour ago
I wish there was a search bar for the terms, I wanna see for "gate".
Labo33341 minutes ago
I thought about that, I might add it if I can find a nice design!
khatkhatiabout 1 hour ago
Chrome's `find` finds it for me ;)
Labo33330 minutes ago
I have been using it as well, but I think adding a search bar will heighten the experience. I'm trying out some designs right now :)
shrikant37 minutes ago
Yeah Ctrl/Cmd+F works just fine on Firefox as well.
vadansky27 minutes ago
It's a waste of tokens to do it post-hoc instead of fixing it upstream, but when I see a wall of text I just prompt "TLDR;"